Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

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Stromkraft
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Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Nov 17, 2014 12:58 am

ambientidm wrote:apple is moving away from all user upgrades unfortunately
i am running yosemite on my late 2011 mbp with a newly installed 1gig transcend jetdrive
no issues other than yosemite is buggy and safari is slow super buggy and awful
Moving away what with the? They're not.

There's a reason I never upgrade to any OS X .0. I don't understand any music producer that doesn't both do their homework and at minimum wait for the first incremental version.
Make some music!

Stromkraft
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Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Nov 17, 2014 1:00 am

Buleriachk wrote:I'm SO happy with my W ..... uh, oh, never mind... :)
Yeah, upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 8 went smooth as sailing on a sunny summer day for all music producers. Yes sir, indeed-dee, not a problem in sight.
Last edited by Stromkraft on Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
Make some music!

Buleriachk
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Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by Buleriachk » Mon Nov 17, 2014 1:09 am

Windows 8? What's Windows 8? :)
Stromkraft wrote:
Buleriachk wrote:I'm SO happy with my W ..... uh, oh, never mind... :)
Yeah, upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 8 went smooth as sailing on a sunny summer day for all music producer. Yes sir, indeed-dee, not a problem in sight.

pencilrocket
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Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2010 10:46 am

Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by pencilrocket » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:34 am

Stromkraft wrote:
Buleriachk wrote:I'm SO happy with my W ..... uh, oh, never mind... :)
Yeah, upgrading from Windows 7 to Windows 8 went smooth as sailing on a sunny summer day for all music producer. Yes sir, indeed-dee, not a problem in sight.
Yea, fortunately it didn't format External HD at least.
Image

Stromkraft
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Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:44 am

Buleriachk wrote:Windows 8? What's Windows 8? :)
That's more like it!
Make some music!

perez.5
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Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by perez.5 » Tue Jan 06, 2015 8:46 am

Thanks for sharing the link to that article dear.which I usually plan for my friends and colleagues? Thanks for all your feedbacks in advance.
Last edited by perez.5 on Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

Machinesworking
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Location: Seattle

Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by Machinesworking » Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:11 pm

fishmonkey wrote: the situation isn't as clear cut as OWC makes out.

OWC SSDs use Sandforce controllers, and one of the reasons OWC recommended against enabling TRIM was because an earlier version of the Sandforce firmware had a TRIM-related bug.

TRIM doesn't tend to help Sandforce controllers much as they rely on automatically compressing and decompressing data going to/from the drive, and hence use different garbage collection algorithms. the downside of this is that Sandforce-based SSDs tend to be slower with incompressible data. btw, Sandforce themselves actually recommend using TRIM.

the reliance on TRIM is definitely worth thinking about though, also because TRIM is only a SATA command. so if you are using an SSD over a PCIe, USB, Firewire, or Thunderbolt connection (e.g. in an external enclosure), then you don't have TRIM available either...
Curious about this? I'm about to instal a Samsung XP941 M.2 PCIe SSD in my Mac Pro. From what I've been told for most people using a computer in a non server based application, IE not writing 10GB on the daily, TRIM is not really an issue if the SSD itself has decent garbage collection and you have a decent amount of free space on the SSD.

I would really rather not hack the OS to enable TRIM, and I would rather just install Yosemite on it.
I'm not too worried about this issue though, considering the XP941 is twice as fast as the SATA SSDs it's got a lot of room before the performance drops to a mere 550mbs.

fishmonkey
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Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by fishmonkey » Wed Jan 07, 2015 11:17 am

Machinesworking wrote:
fishmonkey wrote: the situation isn't as clear cut as OWC makes out.

OWC SSDs use Sandforce controllers, and one of the reasons OWC recommended against enabling TRIM was because an earlier version of the Sandforce firmware had a TRIM-related bug.

TRIM doesn't tend to help Sandforce controllers much as they rely on automatically compressing and decompressing data going to/from the drive, and hence use different garbage collection algorithms. the downside of this is that Sandforce-based SSDs tend to be slower with incompressible data. btw, Sandforce themselves actually recommend using TRIM.

the reliance on TRIM is definitely worth thinking about though, also because TRIM is only a SATA command. so if you are using an SSD over a PCIe, USB, Firewire, or Thunderbolt connection (e.g. in an external enclosure), then you don't have TRIM available either...
Curious about this? I'm about to instal a Samsung XP941 M.2 PCIe SSD in my Mac Pro. From what I've been told for most people using a computer in a non server based application, IE not writing 10GB on the daily, TRIM is not really an issue if the SSD itself has decent garbage collection and you have a decent amount of free space on the SSD.

I would really rather not hack the OS to enable TRIM, and I would rather just install Yosemite on it.
I'm not too worried about this issue though, considering the XP941 is twice as fast as the SATA SSDs it's got a lot of room before the performance drops to a mere 550mbs.
yep, if the drive has decent garbage collection then you will get only a modest performance boost from TRIM. it will reduce write amplification, however, as you say, if you're not writing a large amount of data then that won't matter much either...
badbrainz wrote: I'm a drummer, so I'm already at an intellectual disadvantage here

Machinesworking
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Location: Seattle

Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by Machinesworking » Wed Jan 07, 2015 7:33 pm

fishmonkey wrote: yep, if the drive has decent garbage collection then you will get only a modest performance boost from TRIM. it will reduce write amplification, however, as you say, if you're not writing a large amount of data then that won't matter much either...
Just for fun I'll bookmark this thread and report back.
I'm going to be installing the XP941 as the boot disk in a few days on my Mac Pro.
It's recommended to partition the drive with 5-10% space completely empty for garbage collection, I'm not sure how smart that is, but it seems to make sense?

Anyway I'll give disk speeds now, then 6 months and a year from now.
My guess is TRIM in a completely modern SSD like the XP941 is 100% overrated, but I'll find out anyway. :)


Machinesworking
Posts: 11098
Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2004 9:30 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Yosemite kills third-party SSD support

Post by Machinesworking » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:03 pm

ambientidm wrote:try this
was recommended to me by an apple tech support guy
http://chameleon.alessandroboschini.com
Interesting find for sure. I'm going to run my experiment of not enabling TRIM for a period of six months first, if there's a drop in performance after then this looks like an elegant solution.

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