Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
yur2die4
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by yur2die4 » Tue Jan 20, 2015 6:38 pm

Pretty sure they have drum racks.

Also, they have some pretty good combination deals with Arturia controllers.... In contrast to other options, the software is practically free :P

But I'm holding out. Mostly because I need to see more convincing instances of 'live performance'.

Isn't it true that they have the possibility of clips within clips?

TomViolenz
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by TomViolenz » Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:02 pm

yur2die4 wrote:Pretty sure they have drum racks.

Also, they have some pretty good combination deals with Arturia controllers.... In contrast to other options, the software is practically free :P

But I'm holding out. Mostly because I need to see more convincing instances of 'live performance'.

Isn't it true that they have the possibility of clips within clips?
my set up relies pretty heavily on Lives DrumRack implimentation with sends etc.
Also Samplers SampleSelector is crucial for me.

So if Bitwig has neither, then I'm simply not interested.

tedlogan
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by tedlogan » Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:20 pm

Sean_Clarke wrote:
be tonal wrote:
Sean_Clarke wrote:the side chain modulation stuff they added for per note control was pretty amazing in the last .1 update, a bit like Plock on my Analog4
What´s this? I use the note expression stuff all the time, is there a way to further control them?
I was on about this Note Modulation Device

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... CkAkqdBXe4
Got my attention now as well.

beats me
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by beats me » Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:32 pm

So at this point for Live users what are the current deal breakers with Bitwig? Last I remember there were some glaring omissions but I don’t remember what they are.

Because789
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by Because789 » Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:41 pm

TomViolenz wrote: my set up relies pretty heavily on Lives DrumRack implimentation with sends etc.
Also Samplers SampleSelector is crucial for me.
It looks like there's no SampleSelector, but there's a workaround (might be outdated, don't know):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNwA2Hs5D3s

I don't think the drum racks have sends.

All the midi and audio editing possibilities look nice, but it seems to me that I would miss Live very soon when it comes to performing live.
Live 9.5 (64bit), Max 7.0.6, Windows 10, Push 2, Korg electribe2, Bass Station II, Launch Control XL, Faderfox DJ3

M4L

garyboozy
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by garyboozy » Tue Jan 20, 2015 8:05 pm

beats me wrote:So at this point for Live users what are the current deal breakers with Bitwig? Last I remember there were some glaring omissions but I don’t remember what they are.
clips slots not being midi-mappable is probably the biggest omission.
transport and other global controls not being midi-mappable either is a biggie.
no qwerty keyboard mapping either.
there's no chain selector for container devices, so switching presets is a pain in the arse.
there's no 'note paint' mode in the midi editor - the paintbrush tool paints the notes one by one. grr.
it's also not exactly stable - random weird shit happens all the time.

BUT

there's a lot to love about it. the modulation system is wicked fun. their take on the automation system (clip vs track) is genius, the whole bounce system is a breath of fresh air, and the devs are FLYING. Live's development has always moved at an agonizingly glacial pace, so it's an interesting tortoise/hare thing going on at the moment.

beats me
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by beats me » Tue Jan 20, 2015 8:20 pm

garyboozy wrote:
beats me wrote:So at this point for Live users what are the current deal breakers with Bitwig? Last I remember there were some glaring omissions but I don’t remember what they are.
clips slots not being midi-mappable is probably the biggest omission.
transport and other global controls not being midi-mappable either is a biggie.
no qwerty keyboard mapping either.
there's no chain selector for container devices, so switching presets is a pain in the arse.
there's no 'note paint' mode in the midi editor - the paintbrush tool paints the notes one by one. grr.
it's also not exactly stable - random weird shit happens all the time.

BUT

there's a lot to love about it. the modulation system is wicked fun. their take on the automation system (clip vs track) is genius, the whole bounce system is a breath of fresh air, and the devs are FLYING. Live's development has always moved at an agonizingly glacial pace, so it's an interesting tortoise/hare thing going on at the moment.

Thanks. I stopped using Live a while back in favor of Logic. I needed the limitation of linear composing to keep me focused on getting shit done. I miss session view but it was also my biggest distraction. Similarly I look at Bitwig’s features as cool looking but wonder if I would really utilize them or if they would be another rabbit hole distraction.

Seems heavy users of Live and/or Bitwig are really into modularity and custom building devices and libraries but that’s not really my bag.

TomViolenz
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by TomViolenz » Tue Jan 20, 2015 8:37 pm

Because789 wrote:
TomViolenz wrote: my set up relies pretty heavily on Lives DrumRack implimentation with sends etc.
Also Samplers SampleSelector is crucial for me.
It looks like there's no SampleSelector, but there's a workaround (might be outdated, don't know):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNwA2Hs5D3s

I don't think the drum racks have sends.

All the midi and audio editing possibilities look nice, but it seems to me that I would miss Live very soon when it comes to performing live.
yeah, then no.
I wait till they have that.

So does that really mean that Live is the only DAW that allows 128s?! Or am I missing something?

eyeknow
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by eyeknow » Tue Jan 20, 2015 9:58 pm

So it's not "mind blowing" as we could have expected.

Grouping (which we knew was coming) some browser updates and new content....and a couple of "surprises"

(shrug)

I'll take what I can get though :)

mholloway
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by mholloway » Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:29 pm

jlgrimes wrote:It will be interesting to see if Ableton offers anything this year and will they fix certain areas (PDC?), and what areas will they improve on?. Bitwig seems to be advancing pretty fast. Ableton knows they will need to hit pretty hard on the next version of Live.
For all we know, Ableton haven't even so much as glanced at Bitwig, perhaps ever. That's not a judgement, mind you, just another useless theory: though I could certainly show some practical evidence that nothing -- literally no thing -- done by them since the release of bitwig would suggest even the slightest tremor of concern on their part that, gasp, their ex-employee's start-up might threaten to steal a few slices of the hipster-DAW pie. Meanwhile, of course, the forum runs rampant with the usual bogus speculation about a contest that exists only in the minds of its users...(though somewhere, I'm sure, SOMEbody is tracking the DAW$$ against the OTHERDAW$$, but if there's anything meaningful to be learned from it, nothing resembling substantial fact has trickled into this basement of a forum).

In the realm of actual data, there is nothing to suggest over in the alpha/beta forums that Ableton will be doing anything major at anytime soon, which, I know, is shocking considering the MIND-BLOWING features of bitwig's latest crawl toward increasing relevance: group tracks, audition functionality in the browser, and some new presets. OH LORDY!! I'm sure Gerhard just shat two frankfurters into his gym shorts.

in my opinion, PUSH was ableton's last big PUSH (har!) toward commanding a unique market, and over in beta-land, pretty much 90% of attention has been focused thereabouts for the past dozen or so updates.

/sigh
my industrial music made with Ableton Live (as DEAD WHEN I FOUND HER): https://deadwhenifoundher.bandcamp.com/
my dark jazz / noir music made with Ableton Live: https://michaelarthurholloway.bandcamp. ... guilt-noir

yur2die4
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by yur2die4 » Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:46 pm

I agree. Speculation that 'Ableton has to hit hard' because they are quivering in their boots is kind of silly.

The best they can do is be themselves. It got them this far.

I'm still not sure what the priorities of each DAW are though. As your user base becomes more widespread in demands, it becomes more and more compromising to make each decision. Plus, in the end we all want lean CPU, and stability to be priorities over features. Crazy world.

TomViolenz
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by TomViolenz » Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:09 pm

I agree with the rest of what you said, but this is puzzling:
mholloway wrote: in my opinion, PUSH was ableton's last big PUSH (har!) toward commanding a unique market, and over in beta-land, pretty much 90% of attention has been focused thereabouts for the past dozen or so updates.
Really, like what?!

For me it's actually the screaming inactivety regarding Pushs development, that makes me wonder if they are all out for a several month long company outing since 9.1 was released :x

mholloway
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by mholloway » Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:16 pm

TomViolenz wrote:I agree with the rest of what you said, but this is puzzling:
mholloway wrote: in my opinion, PUSH was ableton's last big PUSH (har!) toward commanding a unique market, and over in beta-land, pretty much 90% of attention has been focused thereabouts for the past dozen or so updates.
Really, like what?!

For me it's actually the screaming inactivety regarding Pushs development, that makes me wonder if they are all out for a several month long company outing since 9.1 was released :x
I meant more in terms of attention = bug fixes. If you look at the changelog / bug fix notes for the last X number of updates, it's mostly Push-centric, though to be honest my focus on has gone a bit vague over the last months in those areas, so my "90%" figure was reckless, though not necessarily inaccurate...
my industrial music made with Ableton Live (as DEAD WHEN I FOUND HER): https://deadwhenifoundher.bandcamp.com/
my dark jazz / noir music made with Ableton Live: https://michaelarthurholloway.bandcamp. ... guilt-noir

TomViolenz
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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by TomViolenz » Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:22 pm

Well, that's kinda my point. If getting a few kinks out (but not the major oversights) of their scripts (!) is already 90%, then 100% doesn't amount to very much at all!

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Re: Bitwig Studio 1.2 'mind-blowing free update'

Post by Stromkraft » Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:57 pm

TomViolenz wrote:Well, that's kinda my point. If getting a few kinks out (but not the major oversights) of their scripts (!) is already 90%, then 100% doesn't amount to very much at all!
Well, Incremental releases are about getting a few kinks out (including the oversights you refer to). What you want though is perhaps Live 9.2. That's where you can expect any new features or larger changes. I certainly prefer if Ableton fix problems rather than adding features. There are currently glaring issues, that if fixed, is worth the same or more than any new "hot" features.

IMHO, these are the well-known
  • Glitches and crackles in the Live 8 audio engine that affects some users
  • PDC Automation
  • the lack of optimized third party VST/AU automation in Push (Why do we even need Ubermap?)
Make some music!

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