LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
irrelevance
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by irrelevance » Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:58 pm

I see 9.2b3 is up already! Go for it Ableton great to see the renewed activity. 8)

Angstrom
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by Angstrom » Wed Mar 04, 2015 10:52 pm

Grill Pheiss wrote:
Ok SO it seems to be related to the new Complex and Complex pro algorythms more than the PDC stuff per say.

what i'm observing when playing back a problem free, "track heavy" BUT "plugin light" 9.1 project in 9.2 :

1) at first playback is pretty chaotic, almost like if 9.2 needed to finish loading some data in order for everything to play right. After a couple of start stop start stop, the audio seems to settle.

2) REGARDLESS OF THE PRECEDING, the tracks that are using COMPLEX AND COMPLEX PRO (migration by default towards the new algorythms in 9.2) are completelly off time, mostly playing back early by enough ms to completelly throw the feel and groove of the whole song off.

This is systematic
Yes there are a few problems with "complex" / elastique3.
Hopefully these are within abletons power to fix, rather than issues within Elastique 3

Michael Hatsis
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by Michael Hatsis » Thu Mar 05, 2015 1:40 am

Grill Pheiss wrote:
Ok SO it seems to be related to the new Complex and Complex pro algorythms more than the PDC stuff per say.

what i'm observing when playing back a problem free, "track heavy" BUT "plugin light" 9.1 project in 9.2 :

1) at first playback is pretty chaotic, almost like if 9.2 needed to finish loading some data in order for everything to play right. After a couple of start stop start stop, the audio seems to settle.

2) REGARDLESS OF THE PRECEDING, the tracks that are using COMPLEX AND COMPLEX PRO (migration by default towards the new algorythms in 9.2) are completelly off time, mostly playing back early by enough ms to completelly throw the feel and groove of the whole song off.

This is systematic
Yeah, lots of extra pops and wierd stuff w the complex pro algo in 9.2. i had to stop using it because of this as I do alot of repitching and formant shifting w complex pro and w 9.2 it just sounded really bad. I'm assuming it will be fixed at some point?

jonbenderr
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by jonbenderr » Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:59 am

Still seeing a delay in sequencer data sent from a max for live device. Bummer.

The delay is microscopic but enough to throw certain functions off.

What's odd is that most VST based sequencers are spot on for timing.

Unless there is something I'm missing. Wouldn't be the first time.

ze2be
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by ze2be » Sat Mar 07, 2015 12:40 pm

The Phat Conductor wrote:OMFG the plugin delay compensation is SO AMAZING!!!

FINALLY!!!

I am A:Bing between two versions of Ableton on the new track I'm working on and it is just CRAZY!
Great! :)

Whats the expected timeframe of the release canditate?
? ? ? ? ?

marcoskohler
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by marcoskohler » Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:16 pm

roomkillahprods wrote:Still seeing a delay in sequencer data sent from a max for live device. Bummer.

The delay is microscopic but enough to throw certain functions off.

What's odd is that most VST based sequencers are spot on for timing.

Unless there is something I'm missing. Wouldn't be the first time.
What's the delay amount? There will always be *some* delay, especially with M4L devices, considering how many of the public ones available are not the most efficient.

Stromkraft
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by Stromkraft » Sat Apr 25, 2015 11:05 pm

vinz89 wrote:What i find really strange with the way ableton deals with PDC is that the soft doesn't seem to have clock sync delay compensation.
Unlike other DAW with full PDC, Live doesn't compensate it's internal clock when dealing with lantency inducing plug-ins, therefore, when yo press play, the playhead starts immediately, even if the audio is delay compensated, leading to a complete GUI mess...

Do you think that's why tempo synced devices are not delay compensated?

Cheers
Vinz
It seems now in 9.2b7, that at least some tempo-synced devices are delay compensated as is the graphic playback position (Also verified in third party Melda MMultiAnalyzer) no matter what high latency is being used (tested with 2048 samples). Could some of you please try and verify this? I tried quickly with auto-pan. Will try more later.

If this is indeed coming in the release, this is huge.

***Update***
That was premature. I'm sorry about that. See below for details.
Last edited by Stromkraft on Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Make some music!

ambientidm
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by ambientidm » Sun Apr 26, 2015 6:47 am

complete horrid buggy mess
freezes push constantly
since the firmware update even the non beta versions are screwed up
almost never recognizes launchpad
typical

Stromkraft
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by Stromkraft » Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:23 am

ambientidm wrote:complete horrid buggy mess
I have actually no issues at all. Push updated. Everything currently works as expected and more including Max devices.
Make some music!

Rold
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by Rold » Sun Apr 26, 2015 10:00 am

Stromkraft wrote: It seems now in 9.2b7, that at least some tempo-synced devices are delay compensated as is the graphic playback position (Also verified in third party Melda MMultiAnalyzer) no matter what high latency is being used (tested with 2048 samples). Could some of you please try and verify this? I tried quickly with auto-pan. Will try more later.

If this is indeed coming in the release, this is huge.
Just tried autopan and autofilter with ozon 5 and invisible limiter in 9.2b7, still not compensated.

Stromkraft
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Re: LIVE 9.2b1 Discuss....

Post by Stromkraft » Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:29 pm

Rold wrote:
Just tried autopan and autofilter with ozon 5 and invisible limiter in 9.2b7, still not compensated.
Thanks, I made a too quick test and added too little latency to make this noticeable. Redid the test with more than 10ms plug-in latency and it failed.

Playback position at first seemed to stand. It wasn't as off as it has been in the past for me. Using 128 samples or 2048 samples didn't make a difference.

Unfortunately there was no difference in 9.1.7. I remember this as typically off with up to half a quarter note when using high latency, so I'm not sure what I'm doing differently. I suppose it may be the simple fact that graphics are played back as accurate as possible being in time with the delay compensation of audio stream, but when the CPU or the graphic card is in full use graphics gets delayed.

So it seems likely this now working is due to me having a new graphics card as well as faster CPU than a month ago. My previous assumption that latency settings offsets graphics such as playback position seems to simply have been incomplete.

The difference with Melda MMultiAnalyzer is striking though. Delay compensation made the waveform of a track and the same wave in the master be painted off with a clear visual distance with the master being out of time. Turning off the old delay compensation in 9.1.7 made this issue go away.

In 9.2b7 this issue is gone completely and both channels are painted in time also with delay compensation active.
Make some music!

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