Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Stromkraft
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by Stromkraft » Sat Oct 10, 2015 2:38 pm

I'm not sure I follow the discussion in the link here, but tracks following would seem to be something you'd need to be able to turn on and off in a controller, unless you always group your project to no more than 8 busses: Anyone uses Icon Qcon Pro with Ableton?

I think I'm leaning to one fader for studio work. Either that or 32, which would mean 4 Qcon Pros in this case.

What I need, as some of you'd know already, is patch programming control of softsynths, where I feel the Push has some glaring shortcomings.
Last edited by Stromkraft on Sat Oct 10, 2015 11:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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fishmonkey
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by fishmonkey » Sat Oct 10, 2015 4:57 pm

in my experience, if you want something that works like a Mackie Control Universal Pro with Live, then a real Mackie Control Universal Pro is still the best option.

the MC protocol is proprietary to Mackie, and i don't know of any completely seamless emulations. also, Live has properly supported Mackie Controls for a long time.

btw, i had an Alphatrack for a while (it's like a Faderport), and i found having only a single fader channel really frustrating.
badbrainz wrote: I'm a drummer, so I'm already at an intellectual disadvantage here

Stromkraft
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by Stromkraft » Sat Oct 10, 2015 11:56 pm

fishmonkey wrote:in my experience, if you want something that works like a Mackie Control Universal Pro with Live, then a real Mackie Control Universal Pro is still the best option.

the MC protocol is proprietary to Mackie, and i don't know of any completely seamless emulations. also, Live has properly supported Mackie Controls for a long time.

btw, i had an Alphatrack for a while (it's like a Faderport), and i found having only a single fader channel really frustrating.
Thanks for sharing this. Did the Alpha work nice with Live 9 otherwise?

I don't think I'd feel hindered by one fader, simply because I accept it's for printing rides and controlling playback and I really don't need to do more than one track at a time. I make much use of busses too. Unfortunately I feel the Mackie Control Universal Pro to be overkill for me. Perhaps when we get rid of the 16 channel Mackie we have in the studio an MCU Pro and an XT Pro could replace that. There's no room in my home studio currently.

How do you feel about this HarveyDoghead? Ebay? You have the room for the Mackie?
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beatz01
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by beatz01 » Mon Oct 12, 2015 2:59 am

HarveyDoghead wrote: Push - Looks like an awesome piece of gear, and I imagine the intergration with live is second to none, however Faders are a must. So its of the cards for this reason.
You do realize that an accompanying Korg Nanokontrol(II) would cost you an additional whopping 20-30 $/EUR used or like 50/new ? It has all the faders you need plus s/m/r plus an additional row of pots - what more do you need...?

pencilrocket
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by pencilrocket » Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:37 am

beatz01 wrote:
HarveyDoghead wrote: Push - Looks like an awesome piece of gear, and I imagine the intergration with live is second to none, however Faders are a must. So its of the cards for this reason.
You do realize that an accompanying Korg Nanokontrol(II) would cost you an additional whopping 20-30 $/EUR used or like 50/new ? It has all the faders you need plus s/m/r plus an additional row of pots - what more do you need...?
why should he invest $500 for a thing that wasn't his priority and only $20 for what he actually wants? I don't know any person who spend his/her hard-earned money like that way...
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beatz01
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by beatz01 » Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:57 am

pencilrocket wrote:
beatz01 wrote:
HarveyDoghead wrote: Push - Looks like an awesome piece of gear, and I imagine the intergration with live is second to none, however Faders are a must. So its of the cards for this reason.
You do realize that an accompanying Korg Nanokontrol(II) would cost you an additional whopping 20-30 $/EUR used or like 50/new ? It has all the faders you need plus s/m/r plus an additional row of pots - what more do you need...?
why should he invest $500 for a thing that wasn't his priority and only $20 for what he actually wants? I don't know any person who spend his/her hard-earned money like that way...
Because he said "awesome piece of gear" and "integration with live is second to none" and that the only thing holding him back was the lack of faders so to me it would only make sense to buy a NK in addition for dirt cheap = problem solved.

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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by H20nly » Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:27 am

Edit N/M

fishmonkey
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by fishmonkey » Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:34 pm

beatz01 wrote: only thing holding him back was the lack of faders so to me it would only make sense to buy a NK in addition for dirt cheap = problem solved.
IMO touch sensitive motorised faders are the only kind of faders worth having...
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TomViolenz
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by TomViolenz » Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:38 pm

fishmonkey wrote:
beatz01 wrote: only thing holding him back was the lack of faders so to me it would only make sense to buy a NK in addition for dirt cheap = problem solved.
IMO touch sensitive motorised faders are the only kind of faders worth having...
Yeah I ride a Bentley or I walk :x

fishmonkey
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by fishmonkey » Mon Oct 12, 2015 10:48 pm

TomViolenz wrote:
fishmonkey wrote:
beatz01 wrote: only thing holding him back was the lack of faders so to me it would only make sense to buy a NK in addition for dirt cheap = problem solved.
IMO touch sensitive motorised faders are the only kind of faders worth having...
Yeah I ride a Bentley or I walk :x
nope, you are more the type to drive a second hand Hyundai and bitch about it...
badbrainz wrote: I'm a drummer, so I'm already at an intellectual disadvantage here

TomViolenz
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by TomViolenz » Mon Oct 12, 2015 10:52 pm

fishmonkey wrote:
TomViolenz wrote:
fishmonkey wrote:
IMO touch sensitive motorised faders are the only kind of faders worth having...
Yeah I ride a Bentley or I walk :x
nope, you are more the type to drive a second hand Hyundai and bitch about it...
my point exactly ;-)

jestermgee
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by jestermgee » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:06 am

Well if you are after DAW controller functions (Track, Sends, Transport etc) I can certainly recommend an MCU or anything that is MCU/HUI compliant.

I have a Push, Launchpad, MCU and keyboards and I simply could not do away with my MCU since it is probably the most used piece of gear I have and teamed up with Bome MIDI translator I have integrated most of lives edit commands (cut/copy/split/consolidate/move etc etc) into all the free buttons. I also have a printable Photoshop overlay that prints perfectly on magnetic paper to simply stick on the surface.... Free for anyone interested (just PM if you have an MCU)

If cost is of concern, I also have used a Behringer BCF before but I personally did not like it because it's such a cheap controller, no display and poor quality faders. Still it is an option for the budget conscious.

I have also owned an Alphatrack years ago and if having only a single fader is no big deal it's very usable because it's MCU compliant, has great feedback and allows complete DAW control (even plugins) though it's not geared towards controlling plugin parameters, more like a small bonus)

Push can of course achieve much of this but pots for track volume control aren't as nice. Hell the launchpad Pro can do much of what you want but again, not as good as the real thing.

The nice thing with the MCU option is as has been said, it is cross-platform and I use it in Nuendo, Sony Vegas and it will work in almost any DAW or video editing suit.

My MCU is now about 5 years old and still works and looks as new as the day I got it. Very well built machines but I purchased mine at a very good price at a time when the Australian $$ was much much better so I saved close to $1K on mine (new from uniquesquared) which was what sold me (was an "ex demo" unit but was actually new after I asked one of the guys a few questions.

deva
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by deva » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:12 am

beats me wrote:
Tarekith wrote:Considering he's asking specifically about a controller for Live, and these are the Live forums, I think Push is more than appropriate. The APC faders are nice, but lack of browsing, note mode, scales, etc all put it behind Push for me. I like faders for volume control myself, but endless rotaries allowing access to more than 8 tracks isn't a bad alternative.

I’m just being the voice of the grass is brown on both sides of the fence and you might want to hop between them. You use other DAWs occasionally. Would you or have you used Push or the APC40 with other DAWs?

BTW, this isn’t a general diss on those controllers or Live.
Push works well with Bitwig...

deva
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by deva » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:18 am

beats me wrote:
TomViolenz wrote:
beats me wrote:OK, I see what you guys are saying. I don’t really perform my music and oddly only really thought about doing that before the APC40 came out and then my focus (reality?) shifted.

Whenever I see vids that have the APC40 or Push in them they are either being used for performance/composing or are a piece of hardware sitting amongst many. Never really see a producer using them for mixdown type things unless that is the advertised point of the video.
So you were sure that he should absolutely NOT get Push, and that people here always suggest it unthinkingly out of habit, yet you have actually never used it yourself and only saw some hype videos?

I see :roll:

Well I have never seen videos of people using Push with Logic, Pro Tools, Reaper, Cubase, Reason, Fruity Loops, Digital Performer, and any other DAW I might be forgetting. That’s the basic point of my posts.

And no, I don’t need to see a video of somebody who Frankensteined together some third party software to get it to work with those, and probably not fully functional. Plug-n-play. That’s how I roll.
PXT General... you can use Push with Logic or other DAW with it... it needs to be configured, but I bet one can find the config files for that in Logic or other forums.

The thing is, if you get a controller that is general for any DAW, it never works so well with a single DAW as does the controller made for the specific one.

The Nektar Panorama P4/6 has custom made scripts for Bitwig, Logic, Cubase and Reason... but not for Live.

pencilrocket
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Re: Chosing a studio controller - DAW functions

Post by pencilrocket » Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:50 am

deva wrote:
beats me wrote:
Tarekith wrote:Considering he's asking specifically about a controller for Live, and these are the Live forums, I think Push is more than appropriate. The APC faders are nice, but lack of browsing, note mode, scales, etc all put it behind Push for me. I like faders for volume control myself, but endless rotaries allowing access to more than 8 tracks isn't a bad alternative.

I’m just being the voice of the grass is brown on both sides of the fence and you might want to hop between them. You use other DAWs occasionally. Would you or have you used Push or the APC40 with other DAWs?

BTW, this isn’t a general diss on those controllers or Live.
Push works well with Bitwig...
no....
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