Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live

Bring Back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality please!

YES: Having every clip the exact same color in a track makes it very difficult to tell different musical ideas apart, especially on-stage. Give users the OPTION of turning this on or off please.
86
83%
NO: Keep this new functionality in 9.5 and do not give users a choice in changing it
18
17%
 
Total votes: 104

chapelier fou
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by chapelier fou » Fri Nov 06, 2015 11:19 am

In the prefs, we should have :

- enable/disable auto track color
- make a"default clip color"section, just add "random" and "as track" on top of the color palette.

That's how it should be according to me.
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Razz CE
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by Razz CE » Fri Nov 06, 2015 12:12 pm

I like the change. I always end up changing the clip colors to something more logical than 'random', based on alternate melodies and such as said earlier in this thread. This just makes it more pleasing to the eye until I get to that step. But I get why others are put off by it, though some are being awfully dramatic about it.

So I'll vote yes in your poll. But in a one-or-the-other scenario, I choose the update. Hands down.
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kirillov
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by kirillov » Fri Nov 06, 2015 1:26 pm

+1 for the CHOICE :-)
I actually use color coding a lot for SCENES, and TRACKS and Clips. so I d wish there where Multicolor LEDs for the SCENE buttons.. its usefull to indicate intro, chorus, breakdown whatever...
btw I think an armed track button should be allways RED! for live jamming its nealy impossible
to see if a track is armed or not...
cheers--

thecld
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by thecld » Fri Nov 06, 2015 4:59 pm

I really like the new auto colour behaviour but there should be an option to change it back.
Image

NoSonic822
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by NoSonic822 » Sat Nov 07, 2015 9:14 am

solovox wrote:I just cannot fathom why anyone is voting No here. You're saying that other users shouldn't have the choice to turn this off?? I would never deprive other users of the option to do something important for them! What the fuck people?!
because those two options are silly :roll: :lol: .....why even give two options...other than for people to troll you....

personally i found the old way of random new colours to be annoying.....i asked for this to change before on this board so they mustve got that request from others too.

this is the problem with the old way........most of the time it ends up being more confusing than it is helpful......on push i like to have my clips colourt coded yes....but i dont like live choosing those colours for me...never did like that......one alternative solution and way of doing it....would be

live auto assigns colours...but in stages....like tier system

so in preferences yuou would specify ie. a 5 tier topdown colour scheme...so the first new clip gets the 1st colour, the second new clip gets the second colour
and so on.....so you have a way of knowing which clips are early parent clips and which ones are cloned or child clips

you set the first clip colour to Red, then secxond clips get orange...3rd clips get yellow etc..

but still....Live is not that advanced clearly......so you have to go with this certainty the new way they have it...or the old way which is random but "maybe helpful" some of the time...

but anyway im glad they changed it because it makes everything more organized....

when youre wquickly looking at the session pads...and you know you always use RED for your kick track....you know that when you quickly glance at the pads and you see red...that you just need to PUSH RED.........this is very helpful....whereas in the past.......you end up with all these random colours on there and when you quickly look during performance....you have no idea what track it is....

what this new way does is it gives you CERTAINTY...and when i am performing i want certainty...i dont want confusion....thats jus tme though...and I dont have the same performing expereince that you do yet OP..lol........but i will at some point...probably alot sooner now thanks to this update. :roll: :lol:

i think you just need to change your strategy and learn how to use push more effectively....
part of being an electronic artist is adapting to the technology...for techno...you are at the mercy of the technology...so adapt your output based on how the technology is guiding you to do it....you will get no where if you are trying to use a piece of technology in an improper way....ok maybe some happy accidents...but they design it in a way with lots of research and feedback...and maybe just change a little minor aspect of your performance strategy and you will not be upset anymore.
ive always found that setting very annoying and anti-useful in using push.....so the opposite of you

BUT...the one area where i did KINDOF sortof like the old way, was if i was recording vocal takes into an audio track.....so each new take would get a new random colour...instead of just a number............but still i never got any use out of it for performing on push........it was always actually a deterrent to using push effectively almost..

chapelier fou
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by chapelier fou » Sat Nov 07, 2015 9:59 am

Anyway i've always set the colors by hand afterwards, it took maybe 20 minutes of my life in 10 years. BUT, for recording clips, live, coloring as track is great.
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snakedogman
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by snakedogman » Sat Nov 07, 2015 1:39 pm

chapelier fou wrote:In the prefs, we should have :

- enable/disable auto track color
- make a"default clip color"section, just add "random" and "as track" on top of the color palette.

That's how it should be according to me.
^This^

For my way of working the new way is nice, but I can totally understand for other workflow a random color assignment would work better.
It's completely typical of Ableton though to not give users a choice and simply change the behaviour without thinking through what it means for the workflow of users who actually liked the way it worked before.
Now you can look forward to a 10 year campaign to get Ableton to introduce a single extra checkbox in the preferences to get it to work like it did before ;)

oblique strategies
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by oblique strategies » Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:38 am

I have spent years color-coding my clips to my specifications.

I use the color of clips to indicate identifiable categories of sounds (environment, dialog, music, movie sounds, foley, rhythm, etc.) I do not use tracks to do this. And I don't always have the same category of sound on each track.

I am going to have to re-color code every clip every time I drag them in from the browser. This is certainly nothing I want to be doing while performing.

Very disappointed by options being removed.

This looks like a real deal-breaker for me. Until more options are available (hopefully in a later release) I'm forced to stick with Live 9.2.3 or re-color my clips every single time I use them.

P.S.: I don't use Auto-Assign Clip Colors, but obviously the changes Ableton have made are seriously disruptive to my work. I am lobbying for choice.

solovox
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by solovox » Sun Nov 08, 2015 9:45 am

oblique strategies wrote:I have spent years color-coding my clips to my specifications.

I use the color of clips to indicate identifiable categories of sounds (environment, dialog, music, movie sounds, foley, rhythm, etc.) I do not use tracks to do this. And I don't always have the same category of sound on each track.

I am going to have to re-color code every clip every time I drag them in from the browser. This is certainly nothing I want to be doing while performing.

Very disappointed by options being removed.

This looks like a real deal-breaker for me. Until more options are available (hopefully in a later release) I'm forced to stick with Live 9.2.3 or re-color my clips every single time I use them.

P.S.: I don't use Auto-Assign Clip Colors, but obviously the changes Ableton have made are seriously disruptive to my work. I am lobbying for choice.
Well fucking said. Ableton, I hope you are following this thread. Folks like us that make our living on-stage with this program (thank you!!), will be quite lost if you don't give us an option to undo this behavior.
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andrepulse
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by andrepulse » Mon Nov 09, 2015 12:52 am

PLEASE!!! YES!!! BRING BACK!!! This new Auto-Assign f***'d my gig yesterday...
I organized a lot of new traks, saved everything, and when I started Ableton 9.5 in the stage to play.... where were my customizations of colors and renames ???

Why not turn on / turn off??? 9.5.1 URGENTLY! :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea:
Last edited by andrepulse on Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

andrepulse
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by andrepulse » Mon Nov 09, 2015 12:55 am

Ableton Team!!!! Where are you???

soundsliketree
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by soundsliketree » Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:41 pm

(I have sent this as an email to support@ableton.com. If anyone has any other suggestions - please PM me and let me know.)

Dear Ableton development community,
I've been using Ableton Live as my primary studio production and live performance tool from the very beginning: Version 1.  I remember the days before we had MIDI.  I've had various complaints about the software over the years, but mostly I've just loved using Live.  I think it is a fantastic, ground-breaking piece of software, and I look forward to many happy years to come.

However, I find myself deeply troubled by the change you've made to the clip coloring options.  It's not because I don't like the new behavior; it's not useful for me at the moment, but I can imagine finding ways that it will be.  Rather, I'm disturbed by the fact that you *removed* a feature that I and many others have integrated into our workflow - the ability to have each new clip be assigned a new color.  

It's not a question of whether the current or previous situation is better - because it's not an either/or choice.  It's a matter of principle: I believe very strongly that Ableton should not remove features when upgrading the software whenever possible.  In this case, it seems obvious that you could have added the current behavior as a new option - extending existing functionality - rather than removing one functionality when adding another.  There's ample room on the preferences panel, after all.  And, there have been several excellent suggestions from users commenting on the poll thread of ways to implement the current new behavior while keeping the old one (in addition to further color controls that would also be straightforward to implement if you really want to improve the clip coloring functionality).

As I try to understand the motivations behind this change, it occurs to me that either ignorance or arrogance (or both) could be responsible for the way it was implemented: 

Ignorance: Perhaps you not aware of the vast scope of the use cases of the software.  You've made such an open ended creative tool, and this is undoubtably one of the great things about Live.  You may need to do more outreach and learn more about incredible variety of ways people are using the software.  Don't make changes that would seriously harm workflows that have been developed for years around existing features.  This will alienate and anger the core of your most long-time, faithful users.

Arrogance: Or perhaps you do know how folks are using Live in such a myriad of ways, but you've choosen not to care for one reason or another - be it a business model decision, or a desire to shape development in a particular direction regardless of whether it hurts some users.  I think it's fair to shape development by your choices of what new features to add, but surely you can attempt do this without removing features.  In this case, had you attempted this, it seems pretty clear that you could have done it easily and gracefully, without impacting performance or the simplicity of the user interface.

Some of us may remember various times in Live's growth history when features were removed, and the community demanded they be reinstated.  This is another one of these cases, and I hope you'll listen.  

However, even deeper than this particular case is the principle behind upgrading and adding features.  My confidence in the future of this software has been shaken, knowing that with any future update a feature I've relied on for my own use cases could simply be removed.  I think you've made a mistake here, and I request that you correct it in the next update by working out a way to give us both the new and old options.  Furthermore, I'd also like to request that you offer a pledge to your user community that you will do your best to retain all legacy functionality as you continue to develop the software.  

Thanks for reading and considering these suggestions.
Warmly,
eO

oblique strategies
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by oblique strategies » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:41 pm

I have sent basically the same thing I posted in the forum above to support@ableton.com too. If this change is impacting your workflow negatively I suggest you take this more direct approach as well to ensure that Ableton is aware of how severely this change is affecting some of us.

I've also been using Live since version 1. That's 13 years of monetary support to Ableton (though obviously that wasn't money spent annually). I do expect my interests to be taken into consideration by a company that I've supported for 13 years.

One other aspect that this change disrupts: I work in multi-speaker surround audio. I sometimes color-code tracks to indicate what speaker that track may be assigned to for sounds that are stationary. This track color will frequently be a different color that the clips on the track.

solovox
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by solovox » Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:41 pm

Let us know if any of the Abes get back to you. I hope they are realizing the seriousness of this decision and are planning a way to rectify it!
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oblique strategies
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Re: Poll: Bring back Auto-Assign Colors to pre-9.5 functionality

Post by oblique strategies » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:31 pm

Will do.

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