arrangement drifting out of time

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Flange
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arrangement drifting out of time

Post by Flange » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:20 am

I created my song in session view then I dragged my clips to arrangement view. It sounds all fine in session but in arrangement it starts off good but then goes out of time. Im not using any external instruments only plugins. Ive noticed this is happening only if I have dragged the clips over but if record it its fine.

Anyone have any idea what might be causing the drift and how to fix it?
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Joel W-J
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Re: arrangement drifting out of time

Post by Joel W-J » Mon Dec 21, 2015 11:02 am

Yo.
I have been caught out with timing issues when the clips are not quite where they are supposed to be due to the grids being on a very narrow setting. When the clips are duplicated the misaligned clip is too and the timing will be out of course. I'm not saying that this is what you are experiencing but it is the only thing I can think of. Zoom right into the clips and see if they are at the start of the bar/beat/marker point.

If you've done this already then sorry for suggesting something so obvious.

Flange
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Re: arrangement drifting out of time

Post by Flange » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:37 pm

Joel W-J wrote:Yo.
I have been caught out with timing issues when the clips are not quite where they are supposed to be due to the grids being on a very narrow setting. When the clips are duplicated the misaligned clip is too and the timing will be out of course. I'm not saying that this is what you are experiencing but it is the only thing I can think of. Zoom right into the clips and see if they are at the start of the bar/beat/marker point.

If you've done this already then sorry for suggesting something so obvious.
Thanks for the help but I checked and this is not the problem. The midi is drifting. This is so annoying. Its why I have slowly been doing less and less music because every time I get excited and decide to create something Im stopped dead in my tracks by some shitty issue like this that I have no idea how to resolve it. Completely kills all creativity.
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yur2die4
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Re: arrangement drifting out of time

Post by yur2die4 » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:48 pm

Why or how is your midi drifting? At the very worst, you can slice it every few bars and nudge it over. But it should not be drifting. Are you using a certain midi device? Some kind of arpeggiation built into a device? Is it midi recorded from an external source?

Instead of letting these things defeat you, you should:
1. Find the source of the problem
2. Develop techniques for overcoming the problems.

Getting beat up over it is not what makes you stronger. It will not give you the ability to express yourself. Many people have had to overcome worse obstacles and still make music.

It's okay to hit a speed bump. But persevere. You owe it to yourself to keep fighting.

Flange
Posts: 194
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:23 pm

Re: arrangement drifting out of time

Post by Flange » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:00 am

yur2die4 wrote:Why or how is your midi drifting? At the very worst, you can slice it every few bars and nudge it over. But it should not be drifting. Are you using a certain midi device? Some kind of arpeggiation built into a device? Is it midi recorded from an external source?

Instead of letting these things defeat you, you should:
1. Find the source of the problem
2. Develop techniques for overcoming the problems.

Getting beat up over it is not what makes you stronger. It will not give you the ability to express yourself. Many people have had to overcome worse obstacles and still make music.

It's okay to hit a speed bump. But persevere. You owe it to yourself to keep fighting.
I have one track with audio beat loops and one track with predator synth plugin playing a bass line. The bass has a glue compressor. Thats all. It plays very tight but after about 16 bars the bass noticeable begins to drift. is it possible for a project to become corrupt? If so can I move my scenes to a new file and see if that works? Updated: just tried this and it makes no difference.

I know what you are saying about letting things defeat me but my creative pursuits have just become nothing more than endless frustrating time wasting battles with technology. I just do not feel like sitting here watching my life drift by like out of sync midi as I create nothing of any worth. I have been doing this now for over 15 years and I am getting nowhere with it. I just want to throw the whole lot in the garbage because its becoming worthless to me.
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yur2die4
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Re: arrangement drifting out of time

Post by yur2die4 » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:51 am

How are the notes in the midi clip made? Just a standard session view clip? If you double click the clip, does it have an exact length of 16 or whatever bars? No orange digits at the end? Is it 'looped' or is each part placed into the timeline individually?

Same with the audio clip, is it exactly 16 bars in length? Is it a 'loop' that's drawn in, or is it drawn in bar-for-bar?

Is it the notes which are drifting or is there some kind of modulation that is drifting? There would be a difference in approach.

Da hand
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Re: arrangement drifting out of time

Post by Da hand » Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:11 am

One thing to check it to make sure that the length of all your loops are actually the right length once imported in arrangement. For example if you have a 4 bar loop it's length should be showing as 4|0|0 all black in the "length" boxes... if the last number is orange or some other colour than black, then it means the length of your loop is not ending exactly on the zero, but rather some number too small to count as 1/16 of a bar and therefore Live shows it as a coloured zero rather than 4|0|1 or 3|3|3. If this happens, then each iteration of your loop is slightly off and hence there is a larger and larger drift as time goes on.

Otherwise it might be something in the predator's bassline.... if you are using the sequencer then the sequencer setting for the bassline is maybe not synced to the host's (this being Live) sequencer. Or the sequence needs to be re-triggered every so often to keep it's timing. Or if you are using the LFO then sync that. Or if your bassline variation is driven by the oscillators, then sync those, etc... basically, if your Live loops are perfect, then there is a drift in the synth somewhere that is most likely fixable.

yur2die4
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Re: arrangement drifting out of time

Post by yur2die4 » Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:40 am

So I did a search of Predator vst and drift on Google. The second page had a link to a kvr forum post but they are down for maintenance. https://www.google.com/search?q=predato ... n&start=10
"I am a new predator user, just got it today. ... however, I notice in ableton live 8, the arps aren't always in sync, they drift. ... It appears that ableton must pass timing data to the VST plugs"

I'll try to check back on it later

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