overdub automation into arrangement

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
chrysalis33rpm
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overdub automation into arrangement

Post by chrysalis33rpm » Fri Jan 08, 2016 4:58 am

I want to record automation into the arrangement view without overwriting my clips. Seems that this has changed with Live 9. Surely something so simple must still be possible?

sana48
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by sana48 » Fri Jan 08, 2016 6:01 am

Someone else may have a better solution but you can create a dummy audio track and arm it. Then record and make sure the last track you were manipulating is the track you want to automate. Then you can automate without recording over your other track. You can also turn off the midi track overdub in options, but not sure if this works for audio track automation.

i'd love to hear from others what the actual solution is- but this works.

[jur]
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by [jur] » Fri Jan 08, 2016 9:47 am

If your track isn't armed then your clips won't be overwritten.
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Stromkraft
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by Stromkraft » Fri Jan 08, 2016 10:54 am

chrysalis33rpm wrote:I want to record automation into the arrangement view without overwriting my clips. Seems that this has changed with Live 9. Surely something so simple must still be possible?
Overdubbing is fully implemented. You will be overwriting the clips in Arrangement though, unless you record over one clip at a time with a loop. This means that there will be a long clip with retained MIDI notes and recorded automation, but this clip will extend to where there were no clips before for the duration of the overdub recording. This may be irritating. I certainly don't like it.

One alternative to investigate is to use something Like Sixteen Macros to connect another track that receives the recording while the MIDI controller data is sent to the clips affected by it in the destination track. I haven't investigated this myself, but in theory it should be able to set up.
Later, you can copy and paste this recorded automation bit by bit or as you wish into the destination track.

I do something similar when I control and automate an audio effect in a return track from a MIDI track with Sixteen Macros. This way I can automate the return.
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chrysalis33rpm
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Location: San Francisco

Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by chrysalis33rpm » Fri Jan 08, 2016 11:59 pm

[jur] wrote:If your track isn't armed then your clips won't be overwritten.

Right, OK. So is there any way to prevent the track from auto-arming itself?

Even if I don't have the track armed, it still turns the arm button pink and behaves as if it has been armed.

chrysalis33rpm
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by chrysalis33rpm » Sat Jan 09, 2016 12:08 am

sana48 wrote:Someone else may have a better solution but you can create a dummy audio track and arm it. Then record and make sure the last track you were manipulating is the track you want to automate. Then you can automate without recording over your other track. You can also turn off the midi track overdub in options, but not sure if this works for audio track automation.

i'd love to hear from others what the actual solution is- but this works.

OK, thanks that's what I'll do for now. Definitely feels like a hack, though.

chrysalis33rpm
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by chrysalis33rpm » Sat Jan 09, 2016 12:09 am

Stromkraft wrote:
chrysalis33rpm wrote:I want to record automation into the arrangement view without overwriting my clips. Seems that this has changed with Live 9. Surely something so simple must still be possible?
Overdubbing is fully implemented. You will be overwriting the clips in Arrangement though, unless you record over one clip at a time with a loop. This means that there will be a long clip with retained MIDI notes and recorded automation, but this clip will extend to where there were no clips before for the duration of the overdub recording. This may be irritating. I certainly don't like it.

One alternative to investigate is to use something Like Sixteen Macros to connect another track that receives the recording while the MIDI controller data is sent to the clips affected by it in the destination track. I haven't investigated this myself, but in theory it should be able to set up.
Later, you can copy and paste this recorded automation bit by bit or as you wish into the destination track.

I do something similar when I control and automate an audio effect in a return track from a MIDI track with Sixteen Macros. This way I can automate the return.
Cool idea but I hope it can be simpler...it's a pretty simple feature that used to be easy to do.

Stromkraft
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by Stromkraft » Sat Jan 09, 2016 6:59 am

chrysalis33rpm wrote:
Stromkraft wrote:
chrysalis33rpm wrote:I want to record automation into the arrangement view without overwriting my clips. Seems that this has changed with Live 9. Surely something so simple must still be possible?
Overdubbing is fully implemented. You will be overwriting the clips in Arrangement though, unless you record over one clip at a time with a loop. This means that there will be a long clip with retained MIDI notes and recorded automation, but this clip will extend to where there were no clips before for the duration of the overdub recording. This may be irritating. I certainly don't like it.

One alternative to investigate is to use something Like Sixteen Macros to connect another track that receives the recording while the MIDI controller data is sent to the clips affected by it in the destination track. I haven't investigated this myself, but in theory it should be able to set up.
Later, you can copy and paste this recorded automation bit by bit or as you wish into the destination track.

I do something similar when I control and automate an audio effect in a return track from a MIDI track with Sixteen Macros. This way I can automate the return.
Cool idea but I hope it can be simpler...it's a pretty simple feature that used to be easy to do.
Uh, that was two ideas so I don't know which you refer to.

What feature was simple? Overdubbing in Arrangement? It's still simple, no? Are you saying that in Live 8 overdubbing left existing clips intact and sections previously without clips were still empty after you had overdub these? In Live 8 there were no envelopes, so it's not like it was better than Live 9 for automation. Please be more specific on what you find lacking.
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AnalogSyncer
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by AnalogSyncer » Mon May 16, 2016 5:32 pm

I am also struggling with that.

I just recorded a Midi Track into Arrangement Window. Now I want to overdub controller data without overwriting the clip. What are the steps?

sana48
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by sana48 » Mon May 16, 2016 5:46 pm

In preferences make sure midi track over dub is not checked. In the top center of Ableton you'll notice a very small icon, looks kind of like a chain link, engage this button, this allows automation to be recorded. Arm track to be automated and record.

Unless I am missing something.

AnalogSyncer
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by AnalogSyncer » Mon May 16, 2016 5:51 pm

Thanks - I can record automation fine but not controller data which is midi.

sana48
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by sana48 » Mon May 16, 2016 6:02 pm

So you're not getting any midi signals from your controller at all? Or just when you are recording? Can you go into a little more detail about your issue?

AnalogSyncer
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by AnalogSyncer » Mon May 16, 2016 6:06 pm

I got it to work now!

Thanks for the help!

sana48
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by sana48 » Mon May 16, 2016 6:08 pm

excellent.

Wabblo
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Re: overdub automation into arrangement

Post by Wabblo » Thu Sep 22, 2016 5:00 pm

sana48 wrote:In preferences make sure midi track over dub is not checked. In the top center of Ableton you'll notice a very small icon, looks kind of like a chain link, engage this button, this allows automation to be recorded. Arm track to be automated and record.

Unless I am missing something.

Thanks, that sent me in the right direction, but note that the MIDI Arrangement Overdub is NOT in Preferences, it's the + button right next to the REC button. You have to engage both buttons (the "chain link" Automation button and this one).

Don't expect to see the automation on the track after you record, it is in the Envelopes window in the clip itself.

P

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