Label wants me to pay for mastering, etc.

[Glint_Eye]

Hey everyone.

I've been approached be a label owner who wants to release a track of mine.
The thing is he wants me to pay something for mastering, remixes, promotion etc.
I've taken a look at his labels on beatport and everything seems legit and professional,
but i think it's very strange to expect me to pay for the mastering etc.
Isn't it usually like this: The label covers the cost for mastering, promotion,
distribution etc. and gets these expenses back through their partial royalties on the track?

Can someone elaborate? I've never released anything, anywhere yet, so I'm a bit careful here.

Cheers.

[Angstrom]

That sounds pretty weird to me, but it might be your phrasing or my understanding. At the end of the day it's always been the artist who pays, but most artists have never understood the biz. One thing you should be aware of is all the money spent on all the shite like advances, promo, mastering, remixes, or bribing journalists, is a "cost".

The artist gets paid only when the product recoups all the costs.
The costs are all paid for out of the artists side!

So lets say the label "gives" the artist $2000 to record, they pay $500 to the mastering engineer, the label spends a mysterious amount on promo, paying remixers, etc. They add all that together as costs. Lets say $5000 in total costs.

Now they sell 2500 of your track at $0.99 and lets imagine you have an amazing 50% royalty rate and you say "where's my chunk of that money" ( $2475 / 2 = $1237)
They say "No money for you .... you haven't recouped yet!"

So you ask "So, when we sell above $5000 We'll start getting paid money?"
And they laugh at you and say
"nope. For you to get paid you need to sell over $10,000 worth of product. Meanwhile WE are already getting paid "

That's because costs are recouped out of your end.. It's just back-loaded. Think of the record label like a bank which lends an artist money on not very good terms.

That was the traditional record business label deal. Perhaps this is what you are describing.
Good isn't it!

Most modern small-scale "enthusiast" labels are a bit more amenable and will not use that model as there is no real money in the biz anyway.
Although it is now mainly a vanity publishing industry. Pay to play still makes cash. Selling shovels.

[Tarekith]

Speaking strictly of the mastering aspect, I've seen it go both ways. Larger labels tend to work with an ME they know and often will pay for the mastering. Smaller labels a lot of times want the tracks completely finished, including mastering, before they sign them. Usually.

Being asked to pay up from for part of the promotion (not counting your recoup as Anstrom said) seems a bit much to me though.

[Glint_Eye]

Well, i didn't really expect to get any good money out of it anyway, because of bad sales etc.
but at least i expected that i wouldn't have to pay something just to get released in the first hand.

the royalty rate i got offered sounded very nice actually. he offered me 90% on the original and 70% on a remix he will be doing.
but i don't really expect the sales to cover the expenses, which i will have for mastering, promotion etc.
so in the end i guess i just had to pay to get released.

[jlgrimes]

Hey everyone.

I've been approached be a label owner who wants to release a track of mine.
The thing is he wants me to pay something for mastering, remixes, promotion etc.
I've taken a look at his labels on beatport and everything seems legit and professional,
but i think it's very strange to expect me to pay for the mastering etc.
Isn't it usually like this: The label covers the cost for mastering, promotion,
distribution etc. and gets these expenses back through their partial royalties on the track?

Can someone elaborate? I've never released anything, anywhere yet, so I'm a bit careful here.

Cheers.

Not typical but it wouldn't surprise me. Labels nowadays especially smaller labels are expecting the artists to do more. More or less many labels are expecting the artists to have finished products instead of demos.

The label is most likely just expecting to cover the distribution and promotional costs.

That said if you feel you are doing more, you can try to negotiate a higher royalty percentage.

That said mastering is one of the cheaper expenses of putting an album together. Mixing is a lot more expensive. Are they covering that?

If they want you to cover promotions, you might want to consider either a different label or doing everything yourself.

With the internet, digital distribution is probably not that expensive.

Promotion is probably one of the most important aspects of getting your music noticed and I would expect label to help there.


It sounds like a distribution deal (maybe) which might not be what you want, but that said maybe you do.

And as Angstrom said in the end, the artist pays for everything (assuming the album/single is a success).
The label gets paid first. But if you are doing most of the legwork (and capital), it sounds like they are doing very little, I would be very cautious in how much of a percentage they want.

[Glint_Eye]

It seems like i'd have to pay for mastering, promotion and distribution, not for the mixing. I did that myself.

The royalties i got offered sounded pretty decent i guess (see posting above).

I already contacted another person who already released tracks on the label.
It seems like this is the standard procedure for artist on that label.

I guess in a way its understandable, but its pretty off putting in the first moment if you want to release something on a label
and you have to pay for that upfront.

[ChangoM]

At the end of the day, the amount of money that ends up in your pocket is a direct function of actual sales of your track. For the label to have already made you an offer means they have projected those sales and concluded that it will at least be profitable for them. Ask to see those projections. If they show them to you, you'll be able to see, based on their experience, whether it might be profitable for you. If they won't show them to you, ask them (and yourself), "Why not?".

[florian_bl]

It looks as if the label doesn't want to do what a label would traditionally do: Take the financial risk and only get paid if the sales are high enough. They make you pay their expenses so it is no risk for them. Not a fair way of doing business but I have seen this happening a lot. It seems to get more common nowadays. Your choice, if you want to release on this label so badly that you would pay them for it.

Even if they make back all the money, it might not be much left for you. Label expenses are hard to controll for the artist. Unless you are big enough to hire a lawyer, you will have to believe whatever they tell you. If your track gets played and charted by Joris Voorn, Jesse Rose, Ame, DJ Sneak and others plus it becomes a little underground hit around the world, you still can't expect to earn more than EUR 10,- or EUR 20,- in sales after the label took out their expenses. And this is with a 50 % deal already. This just as a guideline, so you can calculate your "earnings" when you decide if it makes sense to pay for your own mastering. Financially it might be a loss for you. If it improves your CV to have released on this label, then maybe take their deal and pay for it.

[Fanu]

Unprofessional.

The label should be the one controlling the quality. They should know who to contact regarding mastering it and paying the expenses for that; it's not like that's a massive expense anyways.
I'd love to help you with that if you decide to have it treated.

The reason a label releases your music is because they believe in it and want to push it, and kicking it off by saying you have to have it mastered does not promote that.

[boogaloo]

You pay for mastering and promotion? This sounds crazy to me.
Isn't this what actually a label does? They should be using their resources to promote your stuff, otherwise wtf are they actually doing?.

[Stromkraft]

wtf are they actually doing?

Putting you as an artist on the label?

[Shift Gorden]

You pay for mastering and promotion? This sounds crazy to me.
Isn't this what actually a label does? They should be using their resources to promote your stuff, otherwise wtf are they actually doing?.

That's pretty normal. The artist is responsible for pretty much every single cost. Usually larger labels pay for everything, but money only goes to the artist after the costs have be recouped.

[mholloway]

Seems like a crap deal to me.... if they aren't paying for mastering nor promotion, what the hell are they actually doing for you?

I'd steer clear, personally.

-M

[störgeräusche]

do not sign with them, if your music is interesting for one label it will be for others as well, look for some serious labels or start your own.