Timing issues - bitwig better?

[yentzee]

Hi!
My setup consistes of live which through an audio plugin triggers the erm multiclock which sends midi clock to three elektron boxes as well as a squarp pyramid sequencer which controls some synths.
Now I am getting serious problems monitoring in live. It seems that the incoming audio streams are not in sync with the audio of live.
First I thought midi clock was responsible for that (unfortunately the offset is NOT constant so I can't set it in the multiclock and everything is ok) but when monitoring the masterout of live and my synths through a hardware mixer everything is in sync.
So it can't be the midclock and has to be the input of live (I suppose the latency compensation).

Is there any fix for that? Several people I spoke to experience th same problem.
At the moment I am monitoring through my mixer and record into live setting monitor to OFF and then everything is fine.
It is a workaround that is ok but it is really annoying as after two beer I get confused by routing the audio in the mixer to the main out, to the bus into live etc.

I had a look at bitwig and like what I am seeing.
Does anyone have experience with this?
Apparently the problem does not exist in Logic but as I just switched back to windows this isn't an option anymore.

I am really thankful for all input.

Cheers,

Jens

[doghouse]

That is totally normal. You are hearing the latency of the signal traveling to your computer and then back out.

It happens with all DAWs, yes even Bitwig and Logic cannot magically know what the roundtrip delay is.

Either continue to do direct monitoring from your mixer or use the External Instrument device which has a latency adjustment control.

[Stromkraft]

At the moment I am monitoring through my mixer and record into live setting monitor to OFF and then everything is fine.
It is a workaround that is ok but it is really annoying as after two beer I get confused by routing the audio in the mixer to the main out, to the bus into live etc.

Yeah, that's the way to do it.

[jlgrimes]

Hi!
My setup consistes of live which through an audio plugin triggers the erm multiclock which sends midi clock to three elektron boxes as well as a squarp pyramid sequencer which controls some synths.
Now I am getting serious problems monitoring in live. It seems that the incoming audio streams are not in sync with the audio of live.
First I thought midi clock was responsible for that (unfortunately the offset is NOT constant so I can't set it in the multiclock and everything is ok) but when monitoring the masterout of live and my synths through a hardware mixer everything is in sync.
So it can't be the midclock and has to be the input of live (I suppose the latency compensation).

Is there any fix for that? Several people I spoke to experience th same problem.
At the moment I am monitoring through my mixer and record into live setting monitor to OFF and then everything is fine.
It is a workaround that is ok but it is really annoying as after two beer I get confused by routing the audio in the mixer to the main out, to the bus into live etc.

I had a look at bitwig and like what I am seeing.
Does anyone have experience with this?
Apparently the problem does not exist in Logic but as I just switched back to windows this isn't an option anymore.

I am really thankful for all input.

Cheers,

Jens

Would using an external instrument device help?

It has a latency slider you can adjust to get recorded midi or effects to line up.

I'm not sure if it works for live monitoring but it is something to try.

Also every track in Live has delay sliders which probably would work as well.

[yentzee]

That is totally normal. You are hearing the latency of the signal traveling to your computer and then back out.

It happens with all DAWs, yes even Bitwig and Logic cannot magically know what the roundtrip delay is.

Either continue to do direct monitoring from your mixer or use the External Instrument device which has a latency adjustment control.

Of course the DAW knows the time the signal takes to travel through. It is the sum of latency caused by buffer size plus latency caused by the plugins and probably a latency caused by the daw.
There are options like latency compensation for this and this is the reason there is a software monitoring built into live. Those options wouldn't make sense at all otherwise. The problem is just that with complex setups and plugins likely to cause delay (sound toys suite for example or look ahead limiters) live seems to get confused and doesn'T handle software monitoring properly.
Also it does work it doesn't seem to work constantly as (what I suspect) the latency compensation isn't fixed even when no plugins are added.

It does record the incoming signal spotten I just don't get why I can't listen to it. There are no plugins on this signal path so it would just be let me hear the recorded signal while it is being recorded.

The signal coming into Live is spot on timewise. When recording with monitor off is will be recorded spot on just monitoring in live the signal delay isn't constant so it doesn't really sync with the rest. Sometimes it works but I suspect that for whatever reason the latency caused by live and the plugins used isn't constant and so the applied latency compensation isn't.

[[jur]]

Would the "reduce latency when monitoring" option help?

[hps909]

cubase does this automatically and flawlessly .. and yes the computer certainly knows the roundtrip latency its a simple calculation . your mixer doesnt display this behaviour because there is not audio conversion going on

live doesn't do this well at all and it's very hit and miss

i also use presonus studio 1 and it doesn't do it well either