Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
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RoP
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Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2008 2:43 pm

Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by RoP » Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:41 pm

HI all,
One thing that I always find a bit nerve wracking when using Ableton Live on stage is the dreaded possibility of not pressing the scene trigger button at the right time!
This is especially nerve wracking when you are performing with other people and are relying on you to keep the song on track.

Depending on how long the clips involved are it can put you in a situation where you simply can't get everyone back in sync.

An idea I have which maybe could help get things back in sync as quickly as possible would be a function which can nudge all playing clips forward or backward by one bar. They way I invisage it, it would quantise the jump. I.e the clips wouldn't suddenly jump back / forward one bar as soon as you hit the button. It would wait until the start of the next bar and then apply the jump at that point.

With this function, you can try and get the song back in sync.

What do people think?
Maybe there is already a way to do this I haven't thought of?

RoP
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by RoP » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:20 am

So no one is really liking my idea huh ;)

Let me explain the main scenario and see if it helps...

Scenario
You are playing scene 1 and you are meant to switch to scene 2. But (for whatever reason) you miss the trigger. So now an extra bar of scene 1 is playing where scene 2 should be.

So of course you trigger scene 2 but after that you also press the new 'forward all clips by 1 bar'. This would mean all the clips queued to play won't play from the start. They will start playing 1 bar into their content.

While you are pressing these two buttons, scene 1 is still playing as normal (although I guess that depends on the trigger quantisation on the scene 2 clips - let's assume 1 bar trigger quantise for all clips for this scenario)

This keeps things in sync. Without the new function, scene 2 would be a bar behind because you triggered it a bar late.

Gregwaah
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by Gregwaah » Tue Dec 26, 2017 11:54 am

It is possible to change the global quantization to trigger 2, 4, 8, and 16 bars. If you changed this, then you aren't under so much pressure to get your timing right and in need of correcting it mid set.

#1thelark
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by #1thelark » Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:26 pm

Some ideas... please check the manual for these topics:
  • syncing tempo via tap button
  • legato mode

yur2die4
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by yur2die4 » Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:33 pm

When you trigger clips, there is still a cursor going in the arrangement view.

Moving this cursor around during play often affects the positioning of things in clips.

jestermgee
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by jestermgee » Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:02 am

Or just practice..Practice...Practice until you get it right. Your fans deserve it.

malutkodon
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by malutkodon » Wed Dec 27, 2017 1:51 am

#1thelark wrote:
  • legato mode
this

Tarekith
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by Tarekith » Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:49 am

jestermgee wrote:Or just practice..Practice...Practice until you get it right. Your fans deserve it.
That is kind of the big deal about playing live, you're supposed to practice and not make mistakes or people will know :)

RoP
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by RoP » Thu Dec 28, 2017 8:59 am

jestermgee wrote:Or just practice..Practice...Practice until you get it right. Your fans deserve it.
Heh of course i practise ;)

I've played dozens of gigs live with ableton and never got the sequencing wrong once in front of an audience...

I don't make this suggestion because I keep getting it wrong.

I make this suggestion because I - on simple basic principle - don't like the idea of a mistake that I have no reasonable way to recover from. Just seems like a very fundemental issue - and if there is a possible way to recover, why not have it there just in case?!

And I know that missing a scene change will mean people will notice it. Im not proposing a way to somehow magically erase a mistake. I just want a way to recover from it as quickly as reasonably possible.
Last edited by RoP on Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:11 am, edited 2 times in total.

RoP
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by RoP » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:03 am

#1thelark wrote:Some ideas... please check the manual for these topics:
  • syncing tempo via tap button
  • legato mode
Don't understand how tapping a new tempo will help?! I'm not talking about being slightly out of time I'm talking about being a whole bar (or possibly more) out of sync with where the song should be (and where the rest of the performers expect it to be)

I guess legato mode could work if the clips in scene 2 were the same length as the clips in scene 1. But what if they are different lengths? (Mine usually are different lengths between scenes)

I also sometimes purposefully want to end some clips someway through them and start the next ones from the beginning. So - again - this will only work for certain songs / situations.
Last edited by RoP on Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:51 am, edited 2 times in total.

RoP
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by RoP » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:05 am

Gregwaah wrote:It is possible to change the global quantization to trigger 2, 4, 8, and 16 bars. If you changed this, then you aren't under so much pressure to get your timing right and in need of correcting it mid set.
This is probably the best suggestion in this thread. Cheers.
I think this could work for some of my songs. But not all. I will probably look at increasing the trigger quantisation where I can...

RoP
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by RoP » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:06 am

yur2die4 wrote:When you trigger clips, there is still a cursor going in the arrangement view.

Moving this cursor around during play often affects the positioning of things in clips.
Not positive this would do what I want but even if it did I can't be switching to arrangement view and messing with cursors live on stage!

paulmaddox
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Re: Solution to 'didn't press scene at right time'?

Post by paulmaddox » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:20 am

If the next scene always needs to be triggered at the same point (eg 16 bars after the previous one starts), just use follow actions rather than doing it manually

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