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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:49 am 

Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:32 am
Posts: 41
chris vine wrote:
Live 10 still spike-ing out the CPU meter and producing audio glitches. I stripped my live set down and no change. The spikes tend to start after 20 minutes or so. Got some 32 bit VSts being jbridged - each instance of which, according to process lasso, uses up CPU.
I use a lot of long delays and freeze delays/reverbs plus a couple of loopers - often at the same time, so I thought maybe it's too much for the CPU - but I never had this with Live 9 32 bit and 64 bit. All seems to be Live 10 unfortunately.

I had the same problem. It was my processor state.

Settings > System > Power & Sleep > Additional Power Settings > Change Plan Settings > Change Advanced Power Settings > + Processor Power Management

From here what you want to do is increase both your minimum and maximum processor state to 100%. This made the glitches go away.

*this reply assumes you are in Windows 10


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:57 am 

Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:01 am
Posts: 662
Location: Brazil
Thanks.
Using Win7 but those features are also there. All at 100%. Am trying Process Lasso again to keep an eye on things.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:59 am 

Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:32 am
Posts: 41
chris vine wrote:
Thanks.
Using Win7 but those features are also there. All at 100%. Am trying Process Lasso again to keep an eye on things.

no problem


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 1:32 am 

Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2018 1:07 am
Posts: 1
Hey guys, I want to give you a tip I've discovered recently that can improve your CPU:

Don't use other Zoom levels than 100% !

I get around 5% CPU usage improvement on a Macbook Pro 13" 2015.

I was using a Zoom Level since ever and never suspected it could cause any issues. Luckily I read the recent Release Notes https://www.ableton.com/en/release-notes/live-10/#new_feats and saw this useful little line: "Improve Live's performance at zoom levels other than 100%.".

And another graphics weirdness: Ableton seems to favour my external monitor (albeit more pixels), and when its on my Macbook screen, it eats slightly more CPU.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 1:31 pm 

Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:16 am
Posts: 88
Location: Copenhagen
Hey. I to have discovered this. After sitting on the fence for a long time i installed L10.
Sets that run smoothly in L9 are struggling in L10. (audiogaps & crackles)
I also found one of the culprits, to be the new way that L10 handles graphics.
Also it is not only zoom level (set to anything other than 100%) but also a maximized stock plugin eg. Spectrum.
Indeed also maximizing level meters or viewing long chains etc.
The problems does not occur in L9.
This obviously have to be a bug, probably related to the "Intel Iris Graphics 6100 1536 MB" on MacBook Pro (Retina, 13-inch, Early 2015)
I written to support about a week ago, but haven't heard anything.....

Regards
Nils

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2,7 GHz Intel Core i5
Intel Iris Graphics 6100 1536 MB

High Sierra
Plenty of space on the HD
Rme Babyface pro (all new firmware and drivers)

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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:55 pm 

Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:01 am
Posts: 662
Location: Brazil
Good tip on the Zoom settings. I do think that graphics do cause issues with Live (even before Live 10 I used to get issues). My Thinkpad has intel graphics for the laptop screen but external monitors are using an Nvidia card.....

will try the 100% display zoom. I usually have zoom at 120% 8)


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:20 pm 

Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2004 9:30 pm
Posts: 11027
Location: Seattle
I don't have any real answers as to why this is happening for you guys, but in the bigger picture Live has always been a huge resource hog. Live and it's stepchild Bitwig are both heavy CPU users. I used to relate it to the warping, real time polling of pretty much everything etc. that Live does for it's usually smooth operations under task. Compare it to some other older DAWs like Logic or DP that I use and it rarely glitches when adding a soft synth etc. while the tracks are playing. That comes at a price or so it seems, since it's roughly like this, 100 plug ins in DP or Logic before the audio starts crackling become 70 plug ins in Live.

Then there's Reaper, roughly twice the amount of plug ins before cracking as Live, no glitches when adding soft instruments while the sequencer is playing etc. It's obvious by it's footprint it's super tightly coded etc. The downside is also obvious, Reaper is the anti -Live in terms of walking up to it and figuring it out, it's almost open source in terms of extensibility, and the developer obviously never was a GUI or UI person, it's not ergonomic but you can make it ergonomic.

I'm not trying to sell Reaper here, but look at what was added to Live 10, the way it works with Push 2 etc. especially the new built in graphics for Wavetable and other instruments, it's interaction with Max/MSP all that comes at a cost CPU wise. There are probably some bugs related to resource management that will fix some of your woes over time, but there's also the fact that Live 10 is going to use more CPU. The system is set up to be comfortable and quick to learn, Almost everything reacts in real time etc. I think even if you don't use Max/MSP or the embedded instruments and FX it's possible they add to the CPU hit. I know the new delay can kill my 12 core 3.4ghz Xeon in a hot second, Ableton are not making their plug ins multi core capable like U-He that's for sure.

A side note, the only DAW update that used less CPU that I can recall was DP9.51 when MOTU introduced their pre-rendering engine, and some end users had real issues with it, spiking the CPU etc.


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:59 pm 

Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:23 pm
Posts: 1342
Location: Leamington Spa, UK
I too was struggling a lot with crackling and dropouts even with tests using only one channel and some plugins. MY CPU usage would be reported as around 20% in task manager, and per core around 14% - 7% - hexcore, or 12 threads). If it exceeded 60% in Live's core usage meter it would start crackling. Live would crash very often - upon opening another set, closing, and sometimes randomly. Just extremely unstable overall.

I tried:

CCcleaner (which made bootup and everything faster to load overall I must say, cleaning the very cluttered registry)
reinstalling audio interface drivers
changing USB ports/cables
disabling Speedstep in the BIOS
turning off Avast antivirus
trying all sorts of buffer sizes and combinations with small/medium/large options
Cleaned inside of PC and as a bonus the whole studio room!
uninstalling some software I didn't need
stopping processes deemed fine to stop via Google search
minimised startup programs
superantispyware scan
Changing Live's zoom level to 100% (on a 32" monitor this causes some eye strain)
different hardware settings of the audio interfaces (edirol ua25 and pod HD)
followed Ableton's optimisation advice again...and then I spotted their recommendation for ASIO4ALL, which I have tried some years ago for different reasons which didnt work out.

I tried it again. Amazing! Whether it drives the Pod or the Edirol, I can have complex/normal sets again like always with many instances of Satin, Bazille, Soundtoys etc. Better latency too at the same buffer size (256). I have not tried lower yet - maybe I should do so now!

...testing one sec...

..64 samples some SLIGHT dropouts on the same set. 128 samples, or 6ms overall latency - perfect so far. I am very impressed and delighted ! I don't think I've ever had such low latency with no dropouts on an average set of mine. CPU Load Meter going into the 80s, no problems.

So in my case, it was simply old drivers - Edirol's final update was around 2010-ish i think, and the pod HD 2015. THose latest but still old drivers being the culprits after all.

A pity the UA25 still records garbled low bit noise into audio channels even though direct monitoring through it sounds fine, but I can simply use the Pod for that stuff.

Also not a single crash so far tonight, after opening many sets, playing about, adding tracks and lots of u-he/soundtoys stuff. Normally I'd have crashed about 5 times by now.

Cheers

Windows 8.1
Live 10.0.5
i7 5820K hex core @ 4ghz
32GB RAM
500GB Samsung EVO SSD
GTX 980ti
push 2
APC 40
edirol UA25
Pod HD desktop

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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 7:59 pm 

Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 9:48 pm
Posts: 3
Hi guys!

I've still been struggling with this issue and today my friend found a discussion where somebody suggested to disable the bluetooth in MBP. I was skeptic but this solved the situation for now. At least with external display and lid closed I'm able to run my live set that will choke up the live after 1-2 minutes if BT is enabled. Weird solution but something to try out.

Still unable to use the same live set with lid open and external display on. That will make the fans go wild and soon Live will choke again.

-> https://discussions.apple.com/thread/8510397

Cheers,

T


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 9:27 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:38 am
Posts: 2973
teerio wrote:
Hi guys!

Still unable to use the same live set with lid open and external display on. That will make the fans go wild and soon Live will choke again.



I think that is a known Mac specific issue. The fans going wild is the first warning bell, that would mean there is a significant load and heat generated which would then mean it would need to throttle down which of course will affect anything doing real-time stuff.

If the external display is running a large resolution then the cooling in the MBP may not be adequate for the task (some versions are better than others so always worth posting which version you have)

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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:13 am 

Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 9:48 pm
Posts: 3
jestermgee wrote:
teerio wrote:
Hi guys!

Still unable to use the same live set with lid open and external display on. That will make the fans go wild and soon Live will choke again.



I think that is a known Mac specific issue. The fans going wild is the first warning bell, that would mean there is a significant load and heat generated which would then mean it would need to throttle down which of course will affect anything doing real-time stuff.

If the external display is running a large resolution then the cooling in the MBP may not be adequate for the task (some versions are better than others so always worth posting which version you have)


Hi Jester, if you meant which version of MBP.. Mine is MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2015), 2,5 GHz Intel Core i7, 16 GB RAM and 512GB SSD. I'm driving the external display in 2k now but not sure if the 4k makes that much more difference.

-T


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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:15 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2007 4:50 am
Posts: 3982
if your MBP has a discrete graphics chip, then this is always used when an external display is connected, and this generates more heat...

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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:32 pm 

Joined: Sun May 05, 2013 11:25 am
Posts: 325
Location: +ICXC·NIKA+
teerio wrote:
jestermgee wrote:
teerio wrote:
Hi guys!

Still unable to use the same live set with lid open and external display on. That will make the fans go wild and soon Live will choke again.



I think that is a known Mac specific issue. The fans going wild is the first warning bell, that would mean there is a significant load and heat generated which would then mean it would need to throttle down which of course will affect anything doing real-time stuff.

If the external display is running a large resolution then the cooling in the MBP may not be adequate for the task (some versions are better than others so always worth posting which version you have)


Hi Jester, if you meant which version of MBP.. Mine is MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2015), 2,5 GHz Intel Core i7, 16 GB RAM and 512GB SSD. I'm driving the external display in 2k now but not sure if the 4k makes that much more difference.

-T


It doesn't matter what resolution you will have, I have tested. There is something very strange. I can run Logic Pro X and no problem with the fans. But in Ableton it starts immediately. More heat is created and that is the problem, but only when playback. That is ridiculous.

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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 12:24 am 
Site Admin

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2015 3:04 pm
Posts: 1236
Location: Ableton
Hi there,

Some people do indeed have fan issues since L10, it is known and actively worked on.

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 Post subject: Re: CPU usage in Live 10
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:44 am 

Joined: Sun May 05, 2013 11:25 am
Posts: 325
Location: +ICXC·NIKA+
[jur] wrote:
Hi there,

Some people do indeed have fan issues since L10, it is known and actively worked on.


Actually I use L9. The same here.

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