Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
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kpv
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun May 20, 2018 10:51 am

Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by kpv » Sun May 20, 2018 10:55 am

Hello,

here comes a long one for you experienced DAW/Windows users!

I've recently purchased a new machine and Ableton 10 after years of Reaper + hardware sequencer use and must say I'm quiet happy about exchanging interfaces. I'm particularly happy about how smoothly it runs on my computer, both audio and CPU wise, as I've read couple of horror stories about very capable machines being unable to run the Live 10 due to CPU problems. My machine is a 100% updated Windows/driver wise Lenovo Legion y520, i7 7700HQ, 24gb DDR4 RAM and 500gb SSD drive, so the laptop is obviously beyond capable of bedroom production and than some.

However, when I first plugged the machine and set it up + followed every instruction I could find online on how to optimize Windows 10 for DAW usage, the system was totally broken - just pops and crackles. Thats when I learned about "DPC Latency". After some Googling, I downloaded Latencymon and tracked down what drivers were causing the latency, and the reason for total audio crackles was the driver for my WIFI (which seems to be quiet common) and also some latency from the driver for the nvidia video card (which appearantly has shitty drivers for audio). I disabled those as, along with the webcam, bluetooth cardreader and couple of other drivers I'd never be using for a computer that is only used for DAW and wont even be connected to the internet. My computer also has a Intel HD 630 Graphics interface whom does not seem to be causing any issues according to latencymon like the Nvidia card did.

So, after disabling the WIFI driver, my machine went from being 100% useless due to dropouts and all red traces in Latencymon to being perfectly fine, all green traces in Latencymon, and after disabling the other drivers, my system is pretty smooth. However, Latencymon still reports that wdf01000.sys is causing alot of latency, but not those terrible CPU spikes all the time like my wifi card, so there is no dropouts/crackling unless I drive the CPU very hard with vst instruments. I've noticed like one second of droput maybe once every few hours on projects with some VST instruments (I'm mainly sequencing external hardware and using Totalmix/Ableton as mixer). Is that normal Windows 10 performance, or maybe just Ableton 10 yet to become stable?

I've not found a single conclusion on how to disable this wdf01000.sys driver on Google, but couple of other users have been experiencing Latencymon reporting wdf01000.sys as a source of DPC latency, but I'm not sure how bad they were. In my case it does not strike me as a problem, but rather as a psychologial itch, i'm sure many of you are familiar with that feeling.

So, I guess my question is, is DPC latency inevitable in Windows 10 and something users just live with or can it be minimzied even further than already having a smooth system? Latencymon says my system is now "Capable of audio work without dropouts" which is right, no red traces over there and no constant crackle/dropout. Does "DPC Latency" even matter if audio playback is smooth and glitch free? After all, I'm using RME which has the best ASIO drivers. Does anybody have any knowledge about this wdf01000.sys driver who is the main source of DPC latency on my system and can it be disabled like the WIFI/Nvidia driver problems to reduce the Latency Latencymon is reporting even further?


TL;DR Is DPC latency on a Windows 10 inevitable to some degree, is a one second dropout/crackle once every few hours of VST DAW work in Ableton 10.0.1 normal or abnormal if the system with a expensive RME card is up and running, and does anybody know how to disable that wdf01000.sys which Latencymon reports to be the last source of some DPC latency on my computer?


Thank you so much for giving your time to read this, I'm sure the wdf01000.sys driver is cursing many Windows 10 Lenovo laptops, as other people are experiencing this online!

McAnix
Posts: 415
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:42 pm

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by McAnix » Sun May 20, 2018 4:12 pm

Following.

kpv
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun May 20, 2018 10:51 am

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by kpv » Sun May 20, 2018 11:42 pm

:|

strangedaysuk
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun Jul 23, 2017 7:01 am

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by strangedaysuk » Mon May 21, 2018 3:01 pm

Windows is unfortunately not good at handling music. Yes it's possible to achieve it with buying the right hardware and making tweaks etc but you will spend more time tweaking sometimes.

I own a Mac and a PC and there are some who swear Windows is as good as a Mac. Well I don't know what planet they are on because fundamentally this just cannot be. The way Windows handles audio is very poor. Mac as such a good inbuilt core audio driver system, but Windows requires to start with ASIO drivers - because it's own internal drivers are crap to start with.

I use a PC because admirably my aging MAcbook has lost its Bluetooth capability probably a hardware failure. So yes Mac's still have their problems, but a Mac running a stable OS (Sierra seems to be good at the moment) runs smooth and quick. I miss my Mac.

You might solve your concerns, but be prepared to never get to the root cause.

Or take my situation, when I switched over to Windows 10 I was feeling that it was working well, then suddenly after a few months I started getting pops and clicks etc. I still haven't solved them. I never had this sort of erratic behaviour from a Mac. Even if you solve one problem I guarantee Microsoft is just round the corner waiting to throw another one in your face.

Just for the record... I might have upset some users, I am sorry though I work as an IT engineer and I have the great task of amanging MS updates. The way they are updating Windows at the moment is a sham!

Stromkraft
Posts: 7033
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by Stromkraft » Mon May 21, 2018 4:44 pm

strangedaysuk wrote:The way Windows handles audio is very poor. Mac as such a good inbuilt core audio driver system, but Windows requires to start with ASIO drivers - because it's own internal drivers are crap to start with.
But I hear that some drivers, like Focusrite possibly, can have half the latency for recording on Windows. This due to OS low level decisions.
Make some music!

kpv
Posts: 17
Joined: Sun May 20, 2018 10:51 am

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by kpv » Mon May 21, 2018 10:23 pm

I've yet to get to the bottom of this mystery, but in the meantime, I'm going to leave it be and get back to making music (while everything is working I guess). That mystery will eventually be solved by some genius, but that won't be me - I've posted to multiple forums and nobody has the answer, but many friendly people with good answers/suggestions etc. Thanks alot for the replies!

All I know is that my system is working free from dropouts now and wont be connected to the internet again unless I need to activate something. No more screwing around with drivers/updating Windows etc unless necessary, as it turns out that 1100 µs of DPC is the best my system will deliver until wdf01000.sys mystery is solved. Thats not so bad anyway.

And it looks like 10.0.2 or other version in the future will eventually add multicore processing for M4L devices - which should hopefully mean even better performance (for both Windows and Mac users).


From the 10.0.2.b3 Beta release notes:
Multicore rendering in Live is now supported also if a set contains Max for Live devices.

Stromkraft
Posts: 7033
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:34 am

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by Stromkraft » Tue May 22, 2018 7:01 am

kpv wrote: And it looks like 10.0.2 or other version in the future will eventually add multicore processing for M4L devices - which should hopefully mean even better performance (for both Windows and Mac users).


From the 10.0.2.b3 Beta release notes:
Multicore rendering in Live is now supported also if a set contains Max for Live devices.
I interpret this as rendering performance may be improved, not live performance.
Make some music!

strangedaysuk
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun Jul 23, 2017 7:01 am

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by strangedaysuk » Tue May 22, 2018 11:41 am

Stromkraft wrote:
strangedaysuk wrote:The way Windows handles audio is very poor. Mac as such a good inbuilt core audio driver system, but Windows requires to start with ASIO drivers - because it's own internal drivers are crap to start with.
But I hear that some drivers, like Focusrite possibly, can have half the latency for recording on Windows. This due to OS low level decisions.

Hmm maybe I've yet to see it, despite this I've never enjoyed Windows as much.

Try this - put Windows into sleep mode and wake it back up? How did it go? With a Mac it's flawless usually.

Dalibor Loncar
Posts: 241
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2007 4:31 pm

Re: Windows 10 DPC Latency - wdf01000.sys and how to fix?

Post by Dalibor Loncar » Thu May 31, 2018 5:42 pm

kpv wrote:Hello,

here comes a long one for you experienced DAW/Windows users!

I've recently purchased a new machine and Ableton 10 after years of Reaper + hardware sequencer use and must say I'm quiet happy about exchanging interfaces. I'm particularly happy about how smoothly it runs on my computer, both audio and CPU wise, as I've read couple of horror stories about very capable machines being unable to run the Live 10 due to CPU problems. My machine is a 100% updated Windows/driver wise Lenovo Legion y520, i7 7700HQ, 24gb DDR4 RAM and 500gb SSD drive, so the laptop is obviously beyond capable of bedroom production and than some.

However, when I first plugged the machine and set it up + followed every instruction I could find online on how to optimize Windows 10 for DAW usage, the system was totally broken - just pops and crackles. Thats when I learned about "DPC Latency". After some Googling, I downloaded Latencymon and tracked down what drivers were causing the latency, and the reason for total audio crackles was the driver for my WIFI (which seems to be quiet common) and also some latency from the driver for the nvidia video card (which appearantly has shitty drivers for audio). I disabled those as, along with the webcam, bluetooth cardreader and couple of other drivers I'd never be using for a computer that is only used for DAW and wont even be connected to the internet. My computer also has a Intel HD 630 Graphics interface whom does not seem to be causing any issues according to latencymon like the Nvidia card did.

So, after disabling the WIFI driver, my machine went from being 100% useless due to dropouts and all red traces in Latencymon to being perfectly fine, all green traces in Latencymon, and after disabling the other drivers, my system is pretty smooth. However, Latencymon still reports that wdf01000.sys is causing alot of latency, but not those terrible CPU spikes all the time like my wifi card, so there is no dropouts/crackling unless I drive the CPU very hard with vst instruments. I've noticed like one second of droput maybe once every few hours on projects with some VST instruments (I'm mainly sequencing external hardware and using Totalmix/Ableton as mixer). Is that normal Windows 10 performance, or maybe just Ableton 10 yet to become stable?

I've not found a single conclusion on how to disable this wdf01000.sys driver on Google, but couple of other users have been experiencing Latencymon reporting wdf01000.sys as a source of DPC latency, but I'm not sure how bad they were. In my case it does not strike me as a problem, but rather as a psychologial itch, i'm sure many of you are familiar with that feeling.

So, I guess my question is, is DPC latency inevitable in Windows 10 and something users just live with or can it be minimzied even further than already having a smooth system? Latencymon says my system is now "Capable of audio work without dropouts" which is right, no red traces over there and no constant crackle/dropout. Does "DPC Latency" even matter if audio playback is smooth and glitch free? After all, I'm using RME which has the best ASIO drivers. Does anybody have any knowledge about this wdf01000.sys driver who is the main source of DPC latency on my system and can it be disabled like the WIFI/Nvidia driver problems to reduce the Latency Latencymon is reporting even further?


TL;DR Is DPC latency on a Windows 10 inevitable to some degree, is a one second dropout/crackle once every few hours of VST DAW work in Ableton 10.0.1 normal or abnormal if the system with a expensive RME card is up and running, and does anybody know how to disable that wdf01000.sys which Latencymon reports to be the last source of some DPC latency on my computer?


Thank you so much for giving your time to read this, I'm sure the wdf01000.sys driver is cursing many Windows 10 Lenovo laptops, as other people are experiencing this online!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Driver_Frameworks

I would assume wdf01000.sys is not the culprit, it is only affected by something else in your system. start LatencyMon again, this time without your RME soundcard (don´t attach the soundcard) and measure again.

Look for the highest reported DPC routine execution time and report the name of that driver back here.
you don't have any issues if a dropout/crackle occurs once in a while every few hours by the way. don't let your mind fool you. :lol:

the driver architecture mechanisms of MS Windows work with dpc objects.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deferred_Procedure_Call

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