mastering Urgent request!

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
eldad41
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Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2017 11:08 am

mastering Urgent request!

Post by eldad41 » Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:07 pm

Hey guys
need help!!
I sent a song of mine to mastering
And I was asked for the next thing—-

“ 24B version without the stereo out put Limiter”
???

What am I supposed to do, it's possible in ableton?
Need help from you!!
Thanks
Eldad

justanametouse
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by justanametouse » Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:15 pm

Sounds like they want a 24-bit version of your file(s), which means you probably bounced your stuff as 16-bit. As for the limiter part, did you bounce them with a limiter on the master track? If so, I'm guessing remove that as well.

Tarekith
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Tarekith » Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:21 pm

This.

Artcutech
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Artcutech » Mon Aug 13, 2018 5:29 pm

When you go to export your audio it asks for bit depth, yours might be at 16 bit, you can change it to 24b, I’m not sure if this will make a difference if all the audio has already been recorded(actually prob will) in your arrangement but it might in regards to midi clips and that’s how they want the file so thats where you set the bit depth.

By no limiter that means no limiter or plug-in on the master channel, you might not even have one but maybe haven’t given enough headroom which should be at about -3db, if this is the case select all your tracks that have no automation on the volume and drag them down some, do the same with the tracks that have volume automation one by one manually to get to desired headroom, if you have a limiter on the master bus delete and see what your head room is, I hope this helps some you might one to wait for other more in depth and knowledgeable responses

Tarekith
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Tarekith » Mon Aug 13, 2018 6:53 pm

Also, make sure you have dithering turned off when you export as well. The mastering engineer will that for you on their end.

Stromkraft
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:06 pm

Artcutech wrote:…enough headroom which should be at about -3db,
The master house/engineer will have an idea on what they might prefer. It might be something else so could be a good idea to ask.
Artcutech wrote: …if this is the case select all your tracks that have no automation on the volume and drag them down some, do the same with the tracks that have volume automation one by one manually to get to desired headroom, if you have a limiter on the master bus delete and see what your head room is,

Removing a limiter is likely a good first step, but if you have mixed into a limiter or compressor during your mixdown and you remove this, it might be needed to revise fader levels or even track EQ to get the mix to sound like you want. It can also be a good idea to supply the mix with the Limiter as a reference, if you like the sound of that.

If you don't have a limiter it's way faster to just lower the master fader than to adjust each track.

I use Parallel Compression more these days and nothing but a LUFS meter on my main.
Make some music!

Artcutech
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Artcutech » Mon Aug 13, 2018 9:35 pm

Stromkraft wrote:
Artcutech wrote:…enough headroom which should be at about -3db,
The master house/engineer will have an idea on what they might prefer. It might be something else so could be a good idea to ask.
Artcutech wrote: …if this is the case select all your tracks that have no automation on the volume and drag them down some, do the same with the tracks that have volume automation one by one manually to get to desired headroom, if you have a limiter on the master bus delete and see what your head room is,

Removing a limiter is likely a good first step, but if you have mixed into a limiter or compressor during your mixdown and you remove this, it might be needed to revise fader levels or even track EQ to get the mix to sound like you want. It can also be a good idea to supply the mix with the Limiter as a reference, if you like the sound of that.

If you don't have a limiter it's way faster to just lower the master fader than to adjust each track.

I use Parallel Compression more these days and nothing but a LUFS meter on my main.
I don’t think I’ll ever be able to pull down a master fader

I love using parallel compression with the pro c2 but only when mastering and i’ve never had better results

Stromkraft
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Stromkraft » Mon Aug 13, 2018 9:52 pm

Artcutech wrote: I don’t think I’ll ever be able to pull down a master fader
I think I know how you might feel.
Artcutech wrote: I love using parallel compression with the pro c2 but only when mastering and i’ve never had better results
Great. I never master (for release) as I leave that to people more skilled than me. I get on with the next track instead.
Make some music!

Artcutech
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Artcutech » Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:36 pm

Stromkraft wrote:
Artcutech wrote: I don’t think I’ll ever be able to pull down a master fader
I think I know how you might feel.
Artcutech wrote: I love using parallel compression with the pro c2 but only when mastering and i’ve never had better results
Great. I never master (for release) as I leave that to people more skilled than me. I get on with the next track instead.
Sometimes it’ll take me 4 or 5 tries to get a master that I’m happy with for a particular track,and I know that a professional mastering house might give me somewhat better results(sometimes, not always), but what i’ve come to learn over the years is that people don’t know jack about how you want your music to thump or sound. Not all, but so many mastering and audio engineers are stuck in a numbers based world and will look you straight in the face and tell you this is how your mastered audio or mixdowns should sound when your telling them no, I want it like this.

My mastering chain is usually as follows

Uad Ampex ATR-102 mastering tape/pro-q/pro-c2/ozone imager/ozone maximizer

Mastering in all its glory is just a by-factor of a solid mix-down and in the end that’s the biggest step in mastering, having a solid foundation to work with

Btw thank you StromKraft for telling me about the cpu window, that thing stay’s open now, I love to see how my core’s respond under big arrangements, I might not be as good around a computer as some but I know how to use my plug-ins(kind-of haha) and make tracks sound good

Stromkraft
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Stromkraft » Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:11 am

Artcutech wrote: Mastering in all its glory is just a by-factor of a solid mix-down and in the end that’s the biggest step in mastering, having a solid foundation to work with
Ain't that right? It is.
Make some music!

eldad41
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by eldad41 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:12 am

Thanks guys :))
I read and learn from your reactions and explanations
hi
Artcutech :)) from you I understand what I should do, thank you, I want to add the information from the Mastering Technician maybe it will shed light and help more ---
The reason being, you have delivered a 16B 44.1K file that has been limited to the max.

This means it has no dynamics and several instances of distortion.

We are now in a place where we do not have to make it so loud and this helps with the timbre and dynamics of the sound.



Could you please send a link to a 24B version without the stereo out put Limiter on to this email address.

This will allow to process without distortion and let your song breathe.---- Thanks

Artcutech
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Artcutech » Tue Aug 14, 2018 2:10 pm

eldad41 wrote:Thanks guys :))
I read and learn from your reactions and explanations
hi
Artcutech :)) from you I understand what I should do, thank you, I want to add the information from the Mastering Technician maybe it will shed light and help more ---
The reason being, you have delivered a 16B 44.1K file that has been limited to the max.

This means it has no dynamics and several instances of distortion.

We are now in a place where we do not have to make it so loud and this helps with the timbre and dynamics of the sound.



Could you please send a link to a 24B version without the stereo out put Limiter on to this email address.

This will allow to process without distortion and let your song breathe.---- Thanks
Click on your master channel, make sure there are no plug-ins there, if there are delete them, save the arrangement as a new set by going to save live set as and give it a new name I.e. track name-master fix. After/If there is no plug-ins on the master channel then hit play in session mode and watch the little rectangular circular shaped dB meter above the two green left and right levels on the master channel for the whole track, this is where it will show how much headroom you have, if it turns yellow and shows a +(insert # here)dB that’s not good and your track is clipping in that spot(most limiters will make your song really loud but not go past 0dB) so go in your mixdown and turn everything down so you don’t clip. StromKraft mentioned that it might be easier for you to just turn down the master fader so that your not clipping(yelllow +dB) I never do it this way as I go in a turn all the tracks down inside the mix-down, but in all honesty you might get the same results just turning down the master fader to give the mastering engineer some room.

As StromKraft mentioned you might want to ask how much headroom is needed, email your mastering guy and ask him how much headroom does he want? As -3B is not always enough for some but that’s what I use.

eldad41
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by eldad41 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:03 pm

hi
Artcutech 8)
Thank you very much for your support !!! :mrgreen:
I did according to your explanation
And I sent the file
I received the following message ————
Unfortunately you still have a limiter on which is distorting the track. It is still brick walled I’m afraid.

Have a look at your plugins and take off any Limiters or auto limiter when bouncing out.

What you want to see when looking at the wave form of the track is Peaks and valleys like on the left of the image below.

At the moment you have the image of the squashed peaks.————-

I should mention that I have not used Limiters!!!
only compressor On a musical instrument and not on the master
This whole thing is quite new to me and I thank you for any help
Thank you
Eldad

Artcutech
Posts: 118
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:56 pm

Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Artcutech » Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:24 pm

eldad41 wrote:hi
Artcutech 8)
Thank you very much for your support !!! :mrgreen:
I did according to your explanation
And I sent the file
I received the following message ————
Unfortunately you still have a limiter on which is distorting the track. It is still brick walled I’m afraid.

Have a look at your plugins and take off any Limiters or auto limiter when bouncing out.

What you want to see when looking at the wave form of the track is Peaks and valleys like on the left of the image below.

At the moment you have the image of the squashed peaks.————-

I should mention that I have not used Limiters!!!
only compressor On a musical instrument and not on the master
This whole thing is quite new to me and I thank you for any help
Thank you
Eldad
How much head room do you have on your mix? That’s the little circular rectangular thing(#dB)above the master channel levels? It could be that your using sounds that have been pushed to the max or that one of your track plug-ins is slamming your mix. Even if your sending him in a mixdown with a good amount of headroom if it’s getting squashed/maxed out/limited somewhere, the wave file will look like a giant sausage even if there’s headroom.

My advice would be to go in and solo each of your tracks and see where your levels are constantly near the top, and see what disabling plug-ins on the track does and how you might be able to compensate for the volume to where you want it without the plug-in.

Sorry I couldn’t be more help

Stromkraft
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Re: mastering Urgent request!

Post by Stromkraft » Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:03 pm

Artcutech wrote: My advice would be to go in and solo each of your tracks and see where your levels are constantly near the top, and see what disabling plug-ins on the track does and how you might be able to compensate for the volume to where you want it without the plug-in.
Could also be there is some dominant audio that is already squashed in the clip itself for some reason or by a specific device/plug-in with internal overdrive. Then even if the level is all-right later, the summed signal still would sound squashed.
Make some music!

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