Surround Rendering

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
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Surround Rendering

Post by diefused » Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:39 am


Hopefully somebody can help me out.

I did a Surround mix with Ableton, so i have 6 diskret Audio Tracks. Is there a way to render it?

And How can i Listen to it on my friends Home Surround System? He has a PlayStation. Can it be done with YouTube? DVD? Or what would be your suggests?

Best Dirk

Shift Gorden
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Re: Surround Rendering

Post by Shift Gorden » Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:39 pm

Hey mate,

Did you use a surround-sound tool/VST in Ableton?

I think you need something that's going to encode the output from Ableton as a surround sound file, and then on the other end something that's going to read that surround sound (e.g. can interpret DTS).

Not YouTube - that only plays back in stereo as far as I'm aware. If you can encode surround and write to a DVD, you should be able to play back on a PS4 (assuming the PS4 has surround capabilities).

I'm just not sure how to get the surround format out of Ableton? You might need a separate encoder in there somewhere.

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Re: Surround Rendering

Post by diefused » Fri Mar 29, 2019 8:57 pm

Hey Gordon.

Thanx for your answer.

I did the Session once, in the Theater i worked. I have not used any Surround Tools. I used 6 Tracks which was going to l c r sr sl sub. And i basicly used the volume envelopes.

The idea now is, to use the ps4 and the Surround System from my friend to find out, if the previously session als works at home/smaller Surround Systems. And to put it as a audibly file on f.e. YouTube, which i can Send as a working sample with my vita to get some jobs.

That is the Plan.

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Re: Surround Rendering

Post by ze2be » Mon Oct 14, 2019 4:04 pm

Im looking for the same. With the m4l surround plug its easy to output to multiple speakers directly, but it would be great to find out how to export to 5.1 format that can be burned on blu-ray or dvd or streamed with a spesific file from usb or an app.

What I have found so far is that aparently Live 10 can not export 5.1 files. However Cubase, Logic, Digital Performer and Reaper can do it. Also most of the big video editors can do it, like Final Cut Pro, Premiere and so on. These can all export and encode to formats that 5.1 players can play. For PS4 it can play from a usb stick but it must be AC-3 audio format (dolby digital 5.1) and it must be a video file, acording to the ps4 website these video formats support ac-3:
MKV with AC-3
AVI with AC-3
MP4 with AC-3
MPEG-2 PS with AC-3
MPEG-2 TS with AC-3

Of pure audio files it can not play ac-3, only the standard stereo ones, as far as what their own website lists.

To export from Live to a DAW or Video editor that can convert to ac-3 one can prepare 4 stems: stereo front, stereo back, center and sub. I only have a quad speaker setup for now so im thinking to extract the mono center stem from the stereo front with mid/side eq, and also take the sub stem from the stereo front stem, and then maybe highpass the front and back stereo stems to cut the subs, though I need to read some more about this for sure. For live quad speaker performance I will keep the front stereo fullrange ofc.

How to: Playstation 4 in 5.1 surround.

First you need a hardware 5.1 d/a converter with optical input and analog outputs. (Optical/adat has 8 channels) Conect it to PS4 with an optical cable. Conect the analog outs from the 5.1 converter to your surround speakers. Logitech has some cheep 5.1 speaker packages for around 100€, but you also need the optical to 5.1 converter.

HDSUNWSTD Has a 5.1 d/a converter for about 26€, the 5.1 Audio Gear. These can probably also be conected to smart TVs, and dvd/blu-ray players. Not all smart tvs can output dolby digital 5.1 though. My new 4k LG smart tv can not, but I do have a PS4 I could use. Probably Xbox do the same, I dont know atm.

As far as I can see today neither Youtube nor Vimeo can play back in full 5.1. But apparently they can convert 5.1 uploads to stereo. For now a blu-ray player (needs a blu-ray burner to create the blu-ray disk) or a PS4 with just the file on a usb stick seems like the best bet. PS4 also accept DVDs and Blu-rays but not in 4k, only 1080p. External blu-ray player is needed for 4x video.

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