Looper Sync Problem (Ongoing Issue)

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ethnotronik
Posts: 40
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:33 pm

Looper Sync Problem (Ongoing Issue)

Post by ethnotronik » Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:45 pm

This is my second time to post my synchronization problem with ableton looper.
Looper is out of sync at buffer rates 256, 128. When I set the sample rate to 128 or 256, looper is noticeably out of sync. going back to 32 samples, solves the sync issue. Anyone using the looper at buffer 128 or 256?and encountering sync issues, especially while playing rhythm guitar loops? I am triggering the looper to follow the song tempo and quatization should follow the project.

I thought this problem was present when I had 200+ audio and VST tracks in my live set, but the current project that I am testing on is empty. Lets say I want to add a limited amount of audio and VST channels, I would need to change to higher buffer of lets say 128, even to 256 for live, just to be safe to avoid crackling and glitches.

Am I over-seeing anything about setting up the looper? Would it be possible that I had set it up wrong? I have followed all the guidelines from the manual, and also my search. And, I didn't find the practical solution.

Question for Ableton developers: Is looper able to stay in sync with buffer 256 with my current settings. YES or NO?

If my computer is the bottleneck of the sync issue, I will replace it immediately. But, I need to know for sure if that is the case.
If someone could take the time to help me, I would greatly appreciate this.


This is the only buffer when Looper works in sync:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z6jkqns04wydy ... 3.png?dl=0

The Options check like this (delay compensation and reduced latency when monitoring is checked)
In an empty project like this:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1y4b174redhx0 ... 0.png?dl=0

UA Apollo settings at default(Apollo has minimal input latency, not noticeable):
https://www.dropbox.com/s/a1i7enm1gdo2l ... 0.png?dl=0

Lot of MIDI controllers attached (should not affect anything since the Live project is empty, right?)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qsbd0xtcwhk8r ... 9.png?dl=0

This is how much latency I get in an empty project at buffer 256:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ko0voomz1u1wd ... 1.png?dl=0

This test was done in an empty ableton live set, with one midi track triggering Mikrokorg, 2 looper audio tracks mapped to Soft Step and one VST instrument (NI Massive)

Live10.0.6
OSX 10.11.6
MBP2012 2.6 core i7 16gb RAM
UAD Apollo Quad
Elektron Overhub
2012 MBP 16GB RAM 512SSD 10.11.x, Push2, Xone K2, Minilab MK2, Komplete Kontrol25, Model D, Digitone, Roland TR8s, Eventide Timefactor

ethnotronik
Posts: 40
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:33 pm

Re: Looper Sync Problem (Ongoing Issue)

Post by ethnotronik » Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:03 pm

bump?
2012 MBP 16GB RAM 512SSD 10.11.x, Push2, Xone K2, Minilab MK2, Komplete Kontrol25, Model D, Digitone, Roland TR8s, Eventide Timefactor

[jur]
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Re: Looper Sync Problem (Ongoing Issue)

Post by [jur] » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:23 pm

I just had a look at your audio preferences and... 30+ms of input latency @256samples is HUGE. There's definitely a problem here and I can tell without even looking at your other screenshots that's where you have to find what's going wrong.
Do you have any UAD plugins running on your input channel?
For comparisons: I get 6ms in and 6ms out @256samples (Motu Ultralite).
Ableton Forum Moderator

TLW
Posts: 270
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 2:37 am

Re: Looper Sync Problem (Ongoing Issue)

Post by TLW » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:51 pm

[jur] wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:23 pm
30+ms of input latency @256samples is HUGE.
The image for a 32 sample buffer is barely any less than that, 25.5ms.

I don’t use UAD stuff so can’t really comment on how to set it up, but for some reason at 32 samples the input latency Live reports is up to around ten times what it should be for the buffer size.
Live 10.1 Suite, M4L, 2014/15 MacBook Pro 15.3” Retina i7, OS Mojave 10.14.5. RME UFX, assorted synths, guitars and stuff.

ethnotronik
Posts: 40
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:33 pm

Re: Looper Sync Problem (Ongoing Issue)

Post by ethnotronik » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:48 pm

[jur] wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:23 pm
I just had a look at your audio preferences and... 30+ms of input latency @256samples is HUGE. There's definitely a problem here and I can tell without even looking at your other screenshots that's where you have to find what's going wrong.
Do you have any UAD plugins running on your input channel?
For comparisons: I get 6ms in and 6ms out @256samples (Motu Ultralite).
Thanks for the reply!
This is weird indeed! As soon I select input device in live (UA Apollo) I get 25ms, turning off the input device, latency goes away.
Plugins or no plugins on apollo input, it doesn't make a difference, latency is the same. I am testing Apollo twin, to see how much latency I will get on input device...And both Apollo and Apollo twin give me identical latency on the input device. at buffer 32, it is about 25ms, buffer 256 is 30+ms
Roland Duo capture EX gives 10.6ms input latency at buffer 32, it is about 2.5 times less than apollo...
In the apollo settings there is an option for input delay compensation, I turn it off, but I will test this out in action...
With this setting off, the input device latency is not at 7.89ms at buffer 256...I don't want to keep my hopes up...
2012 MBP 16GB RAM 512SSD 10.11.x, Push2, Xone K2, Minilab MK2, Komplete Kontrol25, Model D, Digitone, Roland TR8s, Eventide Timefactor

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