10.1. Feedback thread

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
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TurboLuck
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Joined: Fri May 31, 2019 3:47 pm

10.1. Feedback thread

Post by TurboLuck » Fri May 31, 2019 4:19 pm

I made an account purely because of my dissatisfaction with the latest update. Here are some of my complaints.

1. 's' key

I really like that we finally have a solo key and when I moved to Live a year ago after being an FL user for 8 years it would've made sense to me that the 's' key would solo the chosen track. When it was announced that the function 's' had in 10.0.6. was to be replaced with the function that would've been intuitive in the first place I only hoped they'd move the command to 'zoom all the way out' to a more sensible key. However that did not happen and now there's no single command for that task.

-> my fix suggestion would be to have that function behind [alt] [x] or something. Just having the function would be great.

2. 'h' key

The function to "optimize" track height is completely useless if you have more than 30 tracks. (depending on screen size of course) I don't know about you but I haven't been able to restrict myself to less than that amount. I often end up with 70-100 tracks which is not much by today's standards.

->my fix suggestion would be to have the zoom all the way function in the program.

3. clip edges and resizing.

If I remember correctly making a clip shorter or longer in 10.0.6. did not require the user to click on the top edge of the clip where the clip name is located. In 10.1. you have to click all the way up there to resize a clip which slows the general workflow down substantially. If you click under the name bar you're adjusting fades. However the 'f' key was added to make fades more accessible. So why on earth would fades be made easier to adjust even without the 'f' key pressed?

->my fix suggestion would be to revert clip resizing to be how it was in 10.0.6. i remember none of my peers saying a word about needing it fixed.

4. things that are _still_ not fixed

This includes but is not limited to MIDI CC 123 all notes off filtering that causes malfunctions with older MIDI controllers. (I've e-mailed support about this and was told that this has been an issue since Live 8.

[alt] [mouse drag] for track resizing is utterly unusable. It makes the whole project blow up on your face.

The community has begged for comping for years now.

The browser randomly 'loses' files that are in the specified directory and appear there after you find them manually and drop them into the project.

5. I didn't want to end this post with only complaints so I'll gather some things that I really like about the new update.

- The new automation features

- consolidating simple delay and ping pong delay into one plugin

- vst3 support (even thought it has been in any other DAW worth its salt for several years now I'm still glad that we now have it in live. Better late than never.)

- bouncing with send effects on

- Freezing with Sidechaining enabled.

TheCoil
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2012 6:12 pm

Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by TheCoil » Sun Jun 02, 2019 3:14 am

I agree with 3., seems like they just made it more awkward to work with clips, resizing, making fades. The way it was prior to 10.1 was very easy and fluid for me.

tomorrowstops
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2019 1:07 pm

Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by tomorrowstops » Sun Jun 02, 2019 11:53 am

Turboluck: Doesn't the 'W' key act as a 'zoom all the way' out function? In arrangement view it 'fits the whole song into view' or am I misunderstanding your goal?

I'll admit it took me a minute to get used to resizing the clips the new way (top edge), but I'll deal. Sounds like the F key allows you to play with fades WHILE you're in automation mode. Instead of toggling out.

All in all, I have yet to find anything negative with the 10.1 update.

I'm really happy to see that pinch zooming is a thing now. That was really the only thing I had been missing (coming from Logic X)! Even still, I figured out how to be comfortable with the zoom options presented.

Its been really interesting to read feedback on Live in these forums. There really seems to be a prevailing negative attitude toward this piece of software. But what I've learned since I started using Live, any Apple product, or any other progressive technology - you need to be able to ADAPT. Whereas a lot of these products offer fairly deep user customization, nothing is ever going to be tailored specifically to your needs. However, if you embrace a more flexible-to-account-for-change workflow, you'll find some zen. I know, I know - easier said then done. :D

Live is a FANTASTIC piece of software, and I have fallen in love with it deeply - I've never had as much fun making music!

e10g
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:38 am

Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by e10g » Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:43 am

the change of the 's' shortcut is insane,,(you can easily press on the solo button, but now its much harder to minimize all the channels) my whole workflow is gone now. alt - u instead? and its doesn't even does the same function.
why can't you change your own shortcuts..?
to be honest this update is seems like just adding unnecessary stuff for the sake of an "update" nothing here seems to make it better (most of it at least)

Mister Natural
Posts: 232
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:44 pm
Location: michigan

Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by Mister Natural » Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:53 am

this may or may not be helpful feedback but the update is running flawlessly here
peace
An Expert Only on What it Feels Like to be Me
& You Are Who You Google

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chris vine
Posts: 674
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:01 am
Location: Brazil

Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by chris vine » Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:47 am

Yeah well I got three BSOD screens from 10.1 yesterday so I went back to 10.0.6 because I had a gig (luckily didn't overwrite the installation) and no probs with 10.0.6.

I did delete the midi remote scripts as usual because I don't like Live taking over my midi controllers and when I looked at the crash report, it seemed like Live was not happy not finding them, but that's just a guess.
Other possibility is Jbridge.

Just mentioning in case anyone else has had problems.

chapelier fou
Posts: 4974
Joined: Mon May 15, 2006 12:15 pm

Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by chapelier fou » Thu Jun 06, 2019 6:20 pm

Nice to know thanks. I’m also getting the habit to delete the remote scripts for the same reason.
MacBook Pro 13" Retina i7 2.8 GHz OS 10.13, L10.0.1, M4L.
iMac 27" Retina i5 3,2 GHz OS 10.11.3 L10.0.1 M4L.

TurboLuck
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri May 31, 2019 3:47 pm

Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by TurboLuck » Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:55 am

tomorrowstops wrote:
Sun Jun 02, 2019 11:53 am
Turboluck: Doesn't the 'W' key act as a 'zoom all the way' out function? In arrangement view it 'fits the whole song into view' or am I misunderstanding your goal?

I'll admit it took me a minute to get used to resizing the clips the new way (top edge), but I'll deal. Sounds like the F key allows you to play with fades WHILE you're in automation mode. Instead of toggling out.

All in all, I have yet to find anything negative with the 10.1 update.

I'm really happy to see that pinch zooming is a thing now. That was really the only thing I had been missing (coming from Logic X)! Even still, I figured out how to be comfortable with the zoom options presented.

Its been really interesting to read feedback on Live in these forums. There really seems to be a prevailing negative attitude toward this piece of software. But what I've learned since I started using Live, any Apple product, or any other progressive technology - you need to be able to ADAPT. Whereas a lot of these products offer fairly deep user customization, nothing is ever going to be tailored specifically to your needs. However, if you embrace a more flexible-to-account-for-change workflow, you'll find some zen. I know, I know - easier said then done. :D

Live is a FANTASTIC piece of software, and I have fallen in love with it deeply - I've never had as much fun making music!
W key fits the song horizontally, but doesn't replace the 's' key functionality vertically.
I'll admit it took me a minute to get used to resizing the clips the new way (top edge), but I'll deal.
see, I don't think of myself as a person who'll "deal" (at least without complaining extensively first) because this change to me is making the application worse on purpose. What was gained with this change in your opinion?

Pinch zooming is _great_ to have - especially if you happen to work with a laptop.

I'm all okay with adapting, if I trust that there's a good reason for that, however this is not an example of a situation like that. For example I, along with a few other users I've talked to would've been fine with adapting to a new 'zoom all the way out' function in a different key perhaps. However I refuse to be happy or 'deal' with changes that purposefully make the application I work on worse.

cotdagoo
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Re: 10.1. Feedback thread

Post by cotdagoo » Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:37 pm

TurboLuck wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:55 am
I'll admit it took me a minute to get used to resizing the clips the new way (top edge), but I'll deal.
see, I don't think of myself as a person who'll "deal" (at least without complaining extensively first) because this change to me is making the application worse on purpose. What was gained with this change in your opinion?
I was one of the people petitioning for utilizing a larger chunk of the clip for dragging and interacting with.. However after it was implemented I found quite a few drawbacks to the change, and given that in every previous version of Live prior to 10 operated with just the top bar being used for resizing - it was hard to change old habits. "Top edge" resizing is actually the "old way" in every other version of Live - so many have been working this way for years.

With more area being used for clip resizing, Fade handles, clip title and making selections within a clip became more of a problem. Fade handles were literally appearing over top of the clip title text, obscuring the clip name if you had a fade. Again, with more area being used for resizing clips - making selections within the clips was now limited to the bottom half of the clip with an invisible line, no distinction where the resizing stops and selection area begins - so many misfires if trying to make a selection, or move the clip (for me at least).

To me it made more sense to move the Fade handles below the clip title as the fade would already be shown in the clip title. Moving the handles below the title ensures the text is never obscured.

In this current implementation there are clear, defined areas for interacting with a clip. Titlebar/text has a defined box for moving/resizing - you know exactly where to click/drag, Fade handles occupy their own space and don't interfere with other actions like resizing.. and Selections can be made using the entire clip rather than an area divided by a invisible line.

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