Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
chapelier fou
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by chapelier fou » Mon Oct 14, 2019 3:42 pm

Sorry, I've got no computer and I meant "pcontrol" of course.
EDIT : or maybe not ! Can't remember. You'll figure it out !
MacBook Pro 13" Retina i7 2.8 GHz OS 10.13, L10.0.1, M4L.
iMac 27" Retina i5 3,2 GHz OS 10.11.3 L10.0.1 M4L.

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Tue Oct 15, 2019 7:35 am

I'm making good progress with your idea.

However, I'm hitting a serious road block.

I can't seem to find a way to tell max/ableton to not record the automation for the 16 physical knobs (the one I want to hide from the view and that I use to conditionally control the virtual knobs).

Only the virtual knobs should be automated/stored, otherwise playing the song will make the wrong knobs move.

I created this post viewtopic.php?f=35&t=236234&p=1764250#p1764250, no success so far.

I need a way to have 16 "live.dials" that are mappable to a MIDI controller (ctrl + M) but not automatable nor stored.

S4racen
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by S4racen » Tue Oct 15, 2019 9:23 am

Thats not possible... MIDI Mapping requires them to be automated and stored....

You could use a gate that switches the automation that they have recorded from being sent to any live.objects etc.

Cheers
D

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:04 am

Using a gate is an idea yes,

But how do I identify whether the knob was updated by my midi controller vs by ableton automation ?

S4racen
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by S4racen » Tue Oct 15, 2019 11:09 am

You can't, I'm not sure why you would want to though?

Use the maxforlive patch to perform, then when exporting turn off the patch to close the gate (you'd have to program that) to then leave the original automation on the target parameters...

Cheers
D

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:04 pm

S4racen wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 11:09 am
You can't, I'm not sure why you would want to though?
I have several parameters I want to automate, I can't record all of them in one recording session so I will overdub automation.

While overdubbing, I need the already automated parameters to trigger the device so I can see the end result.

Just like MIDI overdubbing, you want to listen to the notes you already have played in previous recording sessions while you are recording some more.

I'm very close to achieve my use case, ie. quickly switching between multiple parameters when you only have a few physically.

(Without fiddling with closed-source undocumented ableton python remote scripts. Which may actually not work since it's apparently not possible to listen to device button state changes and therefore use a keyboard key to change banks. As S4racen mentioned here viewtopic.php?p=1764094#p1764094)

It's a use case that I'm sure could be useful to other people and I would gladly document how it all works.

This is the only remaining issue.

S4racen
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by S4racen » Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:33 pm

I've been down this road many years ago and it's a world of hurt.... Wouldn't want to do it again!

Best regards
Darren

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:55 pm

Your software suite looks cool, but I don't want to fiddle with macros in session clips.

Also I want a visual indicator of which bank is selected within the device. Because I have actually 12 banks of 16 parameters and I get lost otherwise.

For this I use "live.text" and I key map to it.

It works really great.

Except for that lone remaining issue.

Thanks for the help though. If you have any further ideas..

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:04 pm

I'm gonna try this

Image

But it's only for clip, I couldn't find the equivalent for the track automation.

If anyone has a better idea..

S4racen
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by S4racen » Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:59 pm

sefable wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:55 pm
Your software suite looks cool, but I don't want to fiddle with macros in session clips.
You don't have to, the code I wrote above switches between the two mappings by pressing the top two encoder buttons of the MIDI Fighter Twister, you can trigger actions from MIDI Messages, Clip Names, Scene Names, Locators in arrangement view, MaxforLive or even OSC...

Cheers
D

S4racen
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by S4racen » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:04 pm

sefable wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:55 pm
Also I want a visual indicator of which bank is selected within the device. Because I have actually 12 banks of 16 parameters and I get lost otherwise.
http://forum.nativekontrol.com/thread/3 ... clyphx-pro

There are two aspects to this initial OSC output support:

OSC Actions: Actions for sending arbitrary OSC messages.

OSC Binding Viewer: Allows the names and values of parameters bound to controls via the Bindings accessory to be sent to an OSC device/app for display purposes.

Best regards
Darren

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:46 pm

You don't have to, the code I wrote above switches between the two mappings by pressing the top two encoder buttons of the MIDI Fighter Twister,
Unfortunately I have 12 banks and I want to quickly access any bank, I also don't want to scroll through them, this is to be used during live performance, this is why I need to use the keyboard.

I have 12 keys mapped on the keyboard, 4 rows of 3 keys.

It's working great, It provides the best user experience.

Also the MIDI Fighter side buttons are not nice to use. The knobs are awesome though.

S4racen
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by S4racen » Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:00 pm

This is not the side buttons, this is the press of the encoders and each button can access a bank directly, you can even trigger the macro from your keyboard....

The example I used was for the first two banks of 32 parameters across two MFT's, you can arrange it anyway you like.

Best regards
Darren

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:19 pm

Unfortunately I use the press of the encoders to reset the knobs to their initial values.

Using the macros in session clip would work but it's tedious, it clutters the set, it needs to be copied from project to project, it's not dynamic : if I add a 13 bank I have to update it manually everywhere. Right now in javascript I have the number of banks and a simple loop creates the banks dynamically. This is because this device will be used for different projects with different parameter banks. I could actually use javascipt and LOM to create session clips, but I would also then need to script the configuration file for ClyphX.

Also, I would need to integrate your OSC display solution so I have visual feedback. Which would also need to be scripted.

It would all work but it would be tedious, not easily portable to different projects and it would cost money.

Whereas right now, I have a perfectly working solution for now and in the long run. I just need to find a way to remove the automation for the physical knobs and it's done deal. So if you have any idea to share please do.

If I can't find a solution I'll just manually delete automation each time I overdub which is a smaller price to pay.

sefable
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Re: Quickly switching MIDI Mappings

Post by sefable » Wed Oct 16, 2019 5:45 am

If anybody knows how to trigger this action in javascript then it's a done deal :

Image

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