Major Problems With Live 11

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:05 am

Dandy Dust wrote:
Fri Mar 19, 2021 11:38 pm
I dont want to spam Ableton´s selling effort on their new product: My problems so far: Pops and crackles for softwaresynth Omnisphere, which has been working just fine on live 10. Popls and crackles from the adat, that was just working fine on live 10... the eastwest famous vst 2 plugin DARK is not reconcnised, Ableton lIve 11 says it "is not compatible" with Live, it just worked finde with Live 10. I dont know what actually is going on... OH, I forgot to say: I habe live 11 CRASHING EACH TIME when quitting the programm... I have not produced a minute of music in the past month, just trying to get on top of all of this.
Right there with you and sorry you are going through a similar experience with Live 11. I wrote this after all the frustration which might help a little: https://medium.com/the-electronic-music ... 4aa6238b07

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:06 am

thezef wrote:
Sat Mar 20, 2021 1:02 pm
actually bought a brand new dell precsion 5540 with L11 in mind, and the glitching and CPU overload with even one brass instrument and no effects is devastating. only form responses from Abelton, red-lettered admonishments about "the situation we're all in these days"...
I've returned L11 and am going back to L10.
I feel your pain. I have lost so much production time battling Live 11's poorly built system. Wrote this which might help: https://medium.com/the-electronic-music ... 4aa6238b07

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:11 am

sinnersoid wrote:
Sat Mar 20, 2021 5:02 pm
11.0/11.0.1 CPU/Disk Overload
2012 Lenovo, i7-3820QM, Windows 10 Pro 64-bit ver. 20H2, 16 GB RAM, ASIO, RME Babyface

My experience:
- Two friends, one with a '16 MacBook and macOS High Sierra, another with a '20 Lenovo and Windows 10, both with adequate RAM, reported nearly identical problems as me and others in this thread, minus the crashing
- High-CPU devices seem to cause more problems than before (one instance of Hybrid Reverb on a return track sometimes adds 9-10% average to Live's CPU meter or 4-5% average to Task Manager's CPU meter)
- Problems seem worse in Instrument Racks with multiple effects, especially if multiple notes played at once or if using 96kHz samples
- 11’s CPU meter, whether Average or Current, reads a higher (sometimes almost double) percentage than Windows Task Manager

Things that help* which I was already doing before 11.0:
- High performance power plan (https://help.ableton.com/hc/en-us/artic ... n-Windows-)
- All drivers up to date, especially audio interface (if used) and GPU
- 10-20% free space on hard drive(s)
- 24-bit, 44.1 kHz sample rate
- Disabling unnecessary background services (many threads about this here and elsewhere)
- Enabling RAM Mode (https://help.ableton.com/hc/en-us/artic ... k-Overload)
- Compressed air through the fans

Things that help* which I have tried after 11.0
:
- Close other programs not being used
- Uninstall 10 and all remaining program files (C:/Program Files or C:/Users/You/AppData)
- Disable Ableton Index in Task Manager (must be done each time Live opens)
- Automatic Updates set to Never
- Interpolation in Sampler downgraded from Best to Good or Normal, especially if using 96kHz samples
- Deactivating clips (MIDI or Audio) not being used instead of simply muting the channel
- Reducing effects in Instrument Racks
- Doubling audio interface buffer size (512 to 1024 samples, in my case)
- Disabling hyperthreading in BIOS (Google how this is done specific to your computer's model)
- Disabling power throttling (Google how this is done in Windows 10)

* = if sometimes just by 1-2% average CPU

Of course, it is best to try one fix at a time while watching both Live's and Task Manager's average CPU meters (or Activity Monitor on a Mac) to see what makes a difference in your case. Hope this helps!
This is super useful and thank you for the detailed thoughts. Any chance you could add this in the comments on the blog post I wrote about this fiasco? If you want to contribute on the blog, your knowledge could help a lot of producers. Let me know
https://medium.com/the-electronic-music ... 4aa6238b07

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:12 am

papawise wrote:
Mon Mar 22, 2021 6:40 pm
sinnersoid wrote:
Sat Mar 20, 2021 5:02 pm
...Of course, it is best to try one fix at a time while watching both Live's and Task Manager's average CPU meters (or Activity Monitor on a Mac) to see what makes a difference in your case. Hope this helps!
Thanks for the recommendations, it can help... but at this point, we all can see that the issues are something wrong with the 11 version and/or VST plugins that needs an update ASAP
I fought Live 11 and won...sort of! lol I wrote this about the experience and it might help you: https://medium.com/the-electronic-musi ... 4aa6238b07

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:15 am

sinnersoid wrote:
Sat Mar 27, 2021 4:08 am
Update: While visiting with the friend running 11.0.1 on macOS mentioned in my previous post, he found a fix for the audio dropouts and Disk Overload indicator problem.

https://help.ableton.com/hc/en-us/artic ... eset-Live-

This friend was part of the beta-testing program for 11, but deleted his beta copy after 11's full release. In Library/Preferences/Ableton, we found folders for not only 11.0 and 11.0.1, but all of the beta versions he had had earlier this year.

Folders for each beta version were deleted entirely. Preferences.cfg was deleted in the 11.0 and 11.0.1 folders. We're not exactly sure which was the culprit.

The machine was restarted, Live's preferences re-set and plugins re-scanned in the software. No more dropouts!

CPU percentages are still high, but only when using multiple CPU-heavy plugins or instruments at once - 11's new individual channel CPU meters will reveal which are causing problems. In his case, a effect rack of 3 grouped Puremagnetik plugins that, when switched off, gained him over 10% average CPU! These plugins (and others by various developers which cause high CPU in 11) did not cause him problems in 10.

Another possibility, which we didn't look into, is the presence of ancient/unactivated/obsolete plugins which Live's plugin scanner might not be "digesting" well. However, that is just speculation.

As for me and Windows 10, all of the tips I listed in my previous post are still working, with the biggest differences resulting from uninstalling 10, disabling hyperthreading, and disabling power throttling (in that order). I have even managed to return Sampler's interpolation up to Best and my audio interface's buffer size back down to 512 samples without problems.

However, multiple CPU-heavy plugins or instruments used at once still cause higher average CPU percentages than they ever did in 10.
Really useful. Thanks for sharing. Where are Live 11's individual channel CPU meters. All I see are the ones at the top right which only show average and current CPU.

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:20 am

Darko_Live wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 8:03 am
Hi All,

Joining the discussion as I am having issues too with my setup and L11.

Recently reinstalled this laptop while having a M1 chip Mac in the Studio.
I ran L11 for the first time this weekend on the M1 with a heavy L10 session and it didn't crash but I'll run further tests.

Now on this laptop running Intel I had these issues.

-Impossible to install some plugins from NI suite (Live doesn't want them)
-Impossible to run some plugins when the session is running, some Native Instruments he did install, but also the Arturia.
Oddly enough when I try several times after having Ableton flash all red and crash some Plugins do open
-After installing some Native Instruments plugins they don't automatically appear in the VST section (like they always did since L6).

I must say there is actually nothing running in Ableton apart from the Arturia suite and only two plugins from NI.

As a side note I don't understand the access to Audio and Midi Effects now in section folders. Meaning clicking twice instead of one, not seeing them all at once (folders close when you open another one), not to mention having to get used to it. Changing things for a better yes, but changing just for changing ... Is there a reason why they did that ?

Last but not least I am looking for a way to reinstall Live10 on my laptop as I would like to run it while they fix all L11 issues. Can't find the installer on ableton.com

Darko.

MacOS Big Sur 11.2.2 (20D80)
MacBook Pro (16-inch, 2019)
2,3 GHz 8-Core Intel Core i9
32 GB 2667 MHz DDR4
Thanks for your comment. I wrote this about the experience I had & some fixes I discovered: https://medium.com/the-electronic-music ... 4aa6238b07
I don't have any NI plugins or Arturia but can say that izotope plugins are very CPU intensive & caused a lot of crashes on my laptop before I switched to a tower.

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:21 am

Dandy Dust wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:45 pm
I have not reported yet, because I am trying on a newer audio interface first:

Unfortunately the order seems to be stuck in the Suez-Channel or something...
Ha! In the line behind the Evergreen. That canal blocker has been moved on so hope your audio interface arrives soon. What did you opt for?

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:23 am

jonbenderr wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 11:52 am
Was having some cpu issues and other nonsense as well. Oddly enough, this cleared up my issues (even on a desktop PC).

https://apteryx.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/ar ... Suspension

I went from crackly clipping and cpu spikes shutting ableton audio down completely to barely cracking 10% CPU.

I run an old i5 4670k processor on 8gb of RAM. Windows 10.

Also have an oddball audio interface (Expert Sleepers ES-9).

Running multiple tracks in from a modular rig, vocals, guitar and a minilogue. I've also been known to abuse reverb and use independent instances on each track.

Might be worth looking into for those having trouble.
Really good find. Can you add this as a comment on the blog post I wrote about this experience? Producers would find that helpful: https://medium.com/the-electronic-music ... 4aa6238b07

luckykat
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:24 am

Porch King wrote:
Tue Mar 30, 2021 1:52 am
I just wanted to chime in and say that I am experiencing most of the problems that everyone else here is. Here's my system:

Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-9700K CPU @ 3.60GHz 3.60 GHz
Installed RAM 32.0 GB
System type 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor
GTX 2080 TI Graphics
Focusrite Scarlett Audio Interface

I've been using Ableton 9 for a few years and then Ableton 10 up until 11 came out. I don't think I've ever seen my CPU meter cross the 35% mark until now. I am not getting semi frequent overload indicators. I've literally never even seen this indicator come on before. I'm so confused. I'm on a beast of a machine that runs most programs really well, games silky smooth at max settings and now I'm getting Ableton overloading in version 11 where it has NEVER done this in any previous version on in ANY of my previous sessions. I feel like I may have made a mistake moving my current projects to Ableton 11. I've shared all these details with tech support. I hope something happens and that this gets cleared up soon.
Right there with you amigo. Tough spot. Sending you positive vibes. Wrote this about all the bollocks Ableton put us through which might help: https://medium.com/the-electronic-musi ... 4aa6238b07

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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:27 am

Calagan wrote:
Wed Mar 31, 2021 4:11 am
Hello there

These issues are indeed very strange : I'm using a mid-2012 15" model macbook pro running Mojave, and I don't have any issue with Live 11.
It runs as smooth as Live 10 (and I'm able to say this because I tested both versions extensively with a test I describe below).

But there is a BIG CHANGE regarding the CPU-Meter in Live 11. Before assuming you've got issues with Live 11 when comparing to Live 10, you need to be sure it's not a "visual issue" : the cpu-meter in Live 11 is much more sensible and precise than in Live 10, and I think the Ableton support are getting a lot of complaints since the release of Live 11 that are just based a visual bias.

The only way to test the difference between 10 and 11 in CPU managing is to load the same test-set in both versions (I used the demo set of Live 10), then copy the tracks until you hear audio drop-outs and check the number of tracks you achieved in both versions.
I know a lot of people that were complaining about Live 11, made the test and actually found there is absolutely no difference between Live 10 and Live 11...
It was my case with this demo set of Live 10 (only built-in plugins) but too with other sets full of third party plugins (and I use mostly third party plugins from DMG Audio, Native Instruments, Plugin Alliance, Fabfilter, Soundtoys, Fuse Audio Labs, Tokyo Dawn Labs, Black Rooster, etc. etc. etc.)

Personnaly, the only strange issue I had with Live 11 was in opening an old Live 10 set I was using for live concerts (so I didn't touch it since 1 year, but I hope I will use it in some months) : 2 Kontakt instances were taking ages to load, and sometimes the set was just crashing Live.
I noticed that it was much better (i.e. normal) when turning off the wifi : each time I had issues, I was controling a Soundcraft UI24r via a firefox tab at the same time Live was running. So my computer was connected to a wifi spot (but with no internet on it) and Firefox was open. I had the "send usage data" option turned on, and I turned it off after having the issues so this may cause the problem too (sending data that goes nowhere because it sees an wifi connection but it only goes to a mixer, no to internet).

I sent some crash logs to the support, but they didn't find the cause of the issue and I'm not so sure about it myself...
I just usually turn off the wifi each time I need to use some CPU intensive set...

I think before contacting the support, you should test extensively the issue and try to find some reproductible pattern. Wifi, internet and programs running under Live are usually making the most frequent issues - at least in my case.
This is 1st time this suggestion has come up and I really like it. Can you add as a comment on the blog post I wrote about this so it can help other producers? https://medium.com/the-electronic-music ... 4aa6238b07

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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by luckykat » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:29 am

Guitarlos wrote:
Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:02 pm
I'm running Live 11 on a 2018 Mac Intel 6 Core i9 PowerBook.

Thankfully,I have not had all the problems some are reporting. However, the CPU/overload indicator is constantly venturing into the red, and overheating my computer. The fan is going like crazy, but my Activity Monitor says I am only using 25% (or less) CPU capacity. I have experienced this while just testing out a single track using an unmodified Drone Lab improvisational set, and on virtually all of my own new projects in live 11.

Also I ham experiencing are sporatic audio crackles when using the keyboard or editing tracks in Clip View and the PB's Core driver.

I really like Live 11, and I'm hoping greatly that this will be addressed in a future update (soon, please), but for now its back to Live 10. By the way, thanks, Ableton for not overwriting my version of Live 10 - I don't need to reinstall it!
The blog post I wrote about the tawdry experience is here: https://medium.com/the-electronic-music ... 4aa6238b07
Hope it helps. I have managed to make 11 work but was so close to going back to 10.

Unit1248
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by Unit1248 » Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:28 pm

Also having issues with 11. I use a desktop PC with pretty good specs, and still getting more cpu flags and graphical glitches in 11 than I did in 10. Also exports are getting stuck often and glitch out in which case I have to end the ableton process and restart. Hopefully they get this stuff resolved sooner rather than later...

AbletonMASCHINE
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by AbletonMASCHINE » Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:56 pm

Maybe it's time to try 11.0.5b1 if one can't wait for the next release

https://www.ableton.com/en/release-notes/live-11-beta/

.marc.
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by .marc. » Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:34 pm

i think it will not be possible to make ableton worse than it is right now... i only can use 4 tracks... but for maybe 1 minute. after that its full of artefacts... not possible to work with. yes. i try other DAWs at this moments. it is hard, becaus i dont want to change, but with THIS current version... no!

Dandy Dust
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Re: Major Problems With Live 11

Post by Dandy Dust » Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:51 pm

luckykat wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:21 am
Dandy Dust wrote:
Sun Mar 28, 2021 5:45 pm
I have not reported yet, because I am trying on a newer audio interface first:

Unfortunately the order seems to be stuck in the Suez-Channel or something...
Ha! In the line behind the Evergreen. That canal blocker has been moved on so hope your audio interface arrives soon. What did you opt for?
I went for the RME fireface 802 since I have a firewire card on my system already...
Search great DAW?
- BUY ABLETON LIVE 10 SUITE today!
It will be worth every cent. Dandy

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