Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
surgeanthem
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by surgeanthem » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:02 pm

jestermgee wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:49 am
But that's the thing
That's about where you lost me, understand nothing further from that point onward. The problem and explanation from others seems pretty easy to understand, not sure what the malfunction in comprehension is but that story does help to explain a little.

Image
:lol:

The analogy is this: If the stems are my shirt, then I put the shirt on and don't ever wear another one, so it shouldn't ever be lost, or "in another city", as was where I got the shirt story from. If the .asd file is my shirt, well, I'm sorry, but it's not- I can't use it in ableton- it's just a bad picture of my shirt that just takes up empty space on my desktop where it pops up every so often, so I either let it take up space somewhere else (don't know why that should ever be a thing- random files elsewhere that just take up space I have to deal with) or just put it in the trash.

Which on my mac, it seems there is no "trash" but an incinerator. I don't know what happened to my trash can. I didn't buy it new though.

surgeanthem
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by surgeanthem » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:06 pm

[jur] wrote:
Tue May 25, 2021 10:26 pm
surgeanthem wrote:
Tue May 25, 2021 6:46 pm
There are markers that show the outlines of the tracks that say "sample missing".
That's what we were saying: you somehow moved those files to a different place from where they were when you saved your live set.
External hard drive? Cloud storage? Thrash?
No, I never moved them. Apparently Ableton creates a .asd file (WTF) and then I have to deal with that whole nonsense, and then *poof* goes my stems when I move the .asd files (FROM MY F*ING DESKTOP) or delete them.

This is where I try to look elsewhere for other DAWs that aren't as convoluted and difficult to deal with.

jestermgee
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by jestermgee » Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:45 am

The analogy is this:
Yeah I "get it" I just don't get why it needs to be such a convoluted and perplexing analogy considering the actual issue is rather straight forward. Most DAWs and applications create reference and different format files which you need to know how to manage.

Guess not everyone has the tenacity to manage their files efficiently or follow and understand how things are working, that comes with experience. Typically if I hit issues like this I tend to first do a test, look at what happens then understand what those files are and that I need to manage them and NEVER just delete files without first knowing what they are used for, a quick google would help understand what they are for but I suspect you simply neeed to look at the "Collect and Save" option when using samples around your system or recordings so you can collect all the data into your project folder, avoiding all this headache easily.... Some night time reading of the Live manual would help you understand better. Good read, would recommend.

I could not imagine operating in a way where I hit an issue like this I see as "difficult" and completely switch my direction/software instead of understanding the issue, but seems to be how kids operate these days.

[jur]
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by [jur] » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:06 am

I'll add to Jestermgee's post that, a DAW basically is a file management software.
Not any DAW developer underlines this enough unfortunately (I'm sure we are way too many that learned it the hard way, isn't it? :wink: ) and so it's not made obvious that managing files you're working with is as important as understanding how to to select your mic input and record a signal, and it's surely way less enjoyable as designing a synth patch or create a nice melody... but all these are just files, so you're better off learning where they live and how your software deals with them.
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chapelier fou
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by chapelier fou » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:54 am

“Collect & save” and you’ll carry your shirt in your luggage.
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surgeanthem
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by surgeanthem » Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:09 am

jestermgee wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:45 am
The analogy is this:
Yeah I "get it" I just don't get why it needs to be such a convoluted and perplexing analogy considering the actual issue is rather straight forward. Most DAWs and applications create reference and different format files which you need to know how to manage.
It's because it's cluttering up my desktop with junk .asd files (that seriously I cant do anything with) and if I even MOVE them then my sample goes away.
Oh, and apparently when I move the .wav file to a different place the sample disappears as well. I guess it is too hard to have the idea that once a file is in a DAW then it can just exist there? I really don't get it. I guess I don't have to but still this has been horrible

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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by S4racen » Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:28 pm

Collect and Save, end of drama...

Cheers
D

Mark Williams
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by Mark Williams » Fri Jun 11, 2021 2:08 pm

Collect and save and brush up on your file/folder management skills.
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by yur2die4 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:36 pm

With collect and save, Live will create copies of all necessary files (including audio) for that project to run with nothing missing and place them in a project directory. As long as you don’t go digging around in that directory, everything will be there.

If you do not collect and save, Live will always have to reference files in the exact spot where they were when you were using them within Live. If you move that file, Live won’t be aware of that, it’ll have disappeared. If you remove files associated with the audio file, it breaks that clip’s properties within Live. It could be worse. We could be doing destructive editing of our audio files without being aware of it… and potentially mangling all our audio files.

jestermgee
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by jestermgee » Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:19 am

surgeanthem wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:09 am
It's because it's cluttering up my desktop with junk .asd files (that seriously I cant do anything with) and if I even MOVE them then my sample goes away.
Oh, and apparently when I move the .wav file to a different place the sample disappears as well. I guess it is too hard to have the idea that once a file is in a DAW then it can just exist there? I really don't get it. I guess I don't have to but still this has been horrible
Don't save $hit directly to your desktop, use a folder on the desktop if you must save things there (but that is what a file system is for) and then you do not have to worry about a mess and will have everything from a session packed up nicely. Like I have to constantly explain to my 12yo daughter, keep a clean floor and put things away where they belong. If I was starting with Live and noticed files being created and a mess piling up on my desktop, I wouldn't just throw out all my clothes, I would sort them, fold them and put them away into folders.

You delete the files that Live created but then seem perplexed that some things aren't working when you load up a project? That would be the same as taking the wheels off your car then being confused as to why you cannot reverse out your driveway.

If you move files of course your project will be missing them because again, as has been explained (bangs brick against head) Live knows not where you moved your files but note in the bottom status bar it will state missing samples and you can then click this and locate where you moved them to.

Try placing stuff in the draws and your room will be a lot cleaner and you wont loose things all the time and as echoed by the numerous posts already, a handy "collect all and save" feature helps you tidy this stuff up into a neat packaged folder.

If it is all too hard, maybe forget trying to produce music and just listen to what others create, it's not a game everyone has the patience to play.

[jur]
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by [jur] » Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:03 pm

Maybe that's an opportunity to discuss files' management in Live? Taking apart unaware situations like this one here, what do you all think is well thought out, what's not, what's nice but coud be improved etc... ?
That's not a sexy topic I know, but I think it's of the greatest relevance, and it's almost never talked about.
Over the years I think we all developed our won strategies and tricks and I'd be curious to know if there's situations were you always feel like you're repeating a simple step that you think could probably be managed by Live, regarding files management, indeed :wink:
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by Tarekith » Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:19 pm

Cueing Angstrom in 3, 2, 1..... :lol:
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[jur]
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Re: Why does ableton constantly delete my stems? And silence my tracks?

Post by [jur] » Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:27 pm

Tarekith wrote:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:19 pm
Cueing Angstrom in 3, 2, 1..... :lol:
You just destroyed my "let's talk about L9's new browser" bait! Congrats! :lol:
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