Changing master BPM in Ableton moves my clips in arrangement view

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loaub
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Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:29 pm

Changing master BPM in Ableton moves my clips in arrangement view

Post by loaub » Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:46 pm

:cry:

Note; this problem is largely about an issue I encounter in Arrangement view only and is not directly related to audio warping modes.

I've been dealing with this issue ever since I started working in Ableton 10 years ago. I record a lot of (unwarped) audio into Ableton in Arrangement view; a lot of it is on the fly/impromptu recording sessions that I generally record into an Ableton project with the standard 120 bpm set as the tempo regardless of the actual BPM of the audio I'm recording, as my songs frequently have tempo changes during the recording session so setting Ableton's BPM beforehand makes little sense. I then work to put in the correct BPM of the recorded audio as Ableton's master BPM before I add anything to the arrangement or begin to edit the recorded audio clips, but depending on the complexity of the song sometimes it doesn't make sense to program in the tempo changes that very moment after recording, especially when working live with collaborators. And sometimes, the tempo(s) I do find are incorrect and I only realize it after the arrangement has been edited, clips have been moved around and additional parts have been added.

This has led me to countless complications and jangly out-of-time tracks as, from my understanding, unless you set the exact correct tempo of a song as the master BPM in Ableton before adding any additional parts or doing any editing, any change to Ableton's master BPM will alter the positions of the individual clips in arrangement view. The clips will move apart from each other and become unsynced, and it's up to the user to manually drag the pieces back into their original positions in relation to one another.

I've been looking for some time for some sort of "arrangement lock" button, where you can easily change a project's master BPM while keeping an arrangement's structure intact. This would make my life so much easier as I wouldn't have to re-create my arrangements every time I have a minor tempo change or update. I keep telling myself it can't be this complicated in Ableton, but 10 years have gone by and I haven't found a solution. So please; is there anything in the works at Ableton that could show that this is a feature that will someday be added?

In the same vein, a "lock midi" function is something that would be hugely beneficial to allow a songwriter to edit the BPM of a project without changing the speed of their midi clips, as there's no way to do that now (besides freezing the midi track which is only a temporary solution). I understand that changing a project's tempo would change the sound of the synth/midi-generated instrument itself; that's not a problem to me. Just being able to lock the midi notes in their original positions/speed regardless of project BPM would be a huge help as I like to free-style on my midi keyboard, but if there's ever an issue with the master tempo, the midi changes along with it. I then have to drag and drop the individual midi notes in the clip to get them to (largely) the same positions as where they were when they were originally recorded; this is a massive bummer and a huge time sink.

I know both midi lock and arrangement lock are features available in Logic as "Lock SMPTE Position". This would help out so many songwriters get their songs in time when finalizing the master BPM after recording a sketch or a demo in Ableton. I know that Logic users really like to use this feature to help get their more free-styled compositions in time, and that someone has made a python script to allow this feature in Ableton 9 which people seemed to enjoy. Is this something that is being talked about as becoming a dedicated feature in Ableton someday? I love Ableton (I have Suite 11, Push 2, etc) but this problem is killing me, and everyone's solution so far has been to switch to Logic, which I deeply don't want to do but have been considering.

Edit; I posted an updated version of this question with some sort of workaround I found explained in the comments; viewtopic.php?f=3&t=244191

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