theres no question that tom is an amazing bassist, and programmer.
But if you guys REALLY want to defend the live drumming that appears at the end of Ultravisitor, then go ahead, you are the foolish ones.
I have played and studied drums for 20 years, including study and performance with Kenwood Dennard, Wynton Marsalis, and plenty of others... Im not going to post any recordings because I dont feel the need to prove anything to you people, and it wouldnt prove my point: that Ultravisitor BY FAR, has the worst drumming of any squarepusher album.
Squarepusher Sound - Can you ID it?
you are nuts. how can you assess technique from a recording?eisnein wrote:again his drumming IS technically proficient even if you choose not to like its style.
it just sounds bad. There is no groove about it, its just not grooving.
I agree, that out of time drums are usually far funkier that electronic programming...that isnt relevant. Im talking about bad performance.
was it you that also thought he used AMen on every track of his? even the ones were it was obvious it was his drums being programmed?
im glad you studied drums for 20 years...apparently noone taught you to be open minded towards appreciating styles you dont understand...
if it is threatening to your simple ear then dont listen, the world continues to change with or without your taste.
im glad you studied drums for 20 years...apparently noone taught you to be open minded towards appreciating styles you dont understand...
if it is threatening to your simple ear then dont listen, the world continues to change with or without your taste.
second class robot
Yo, now THAT is hilarious.eisnein wrote:was it you that also thought he used AMen on every track of his? even the ones were it was obvious it was his drums being programmed?
im glad you studied drums for 20 years...apparently noone taught you to be open minded towards appreciating styles you dont understand...
if it is threatening to your simple ear then dont listen, the world continues to change with or without your taste.
I surely didnt say he uses the Amen on everytrack, though I may have said it seems like it... and that was in response to someone asking how achieve his drum sounds, not in reference to his use of drum sounds explicitly. So now that Ive corrected you on that....
You seem eager to slam my ear. Have you listened to that Aphex track?
Sorry dude, a good ear isnt defined by sitting through a bunch of crappy music.
Its not a matter of taste, its a matter of good and bad.
"Its not a matter of taste, its a matter of good and bad."
a conversation id want to have almost as much as defining what is and isnt art.
"You seem eager to slam my ear."
doesnt really get me off. heh. not really telling you what is or isnt good here so im not really the one slamming others tastes. if you dont like his drumming that doesnt mean he is horrible.
good or bad doesnt exist outside the comic book world. unfort nothing is that black or white. and yes a good ear can be defined but sitting through what one perceives as crappy music- at least to know where one's taste lies.
go join my forum. joking joking.
a conversation id want to have almost as much as defining what is and isnt art.
"You seem eager to slam my ear."
doesnt really get me off. heh. not really telling you what is or isnt good here so im not really the one slamming others tastes. if you dont like his drumming that doesnt mean he is horrible.
good or bad doesnt exist outside the comic book world. unfort nothing is that black or white. and yes a good ear can be defined but sitting through what one perceives as crappy music- at least to know where one's taste lies.
go join my forum. joking joking.
second class robot
Sorry, I have a far different view on this subject.
Music is either good, or its bad. There is no grey area, and if there is, its probably bad.
I made no comment on Squarepushers music as a whole, I wouldnt do that. He certainly isnt horrible...I would never say that. I really like the guy, and his work. But that isnt going to stop me from critically analyzing what I hear. And especially when dealing with an artist who is known for his empirical precision, I found it shocking that such unrefined work would make it to his newest disc, which was lauded as his Dark Side of the Moon.
what makes a good ear is the subsequent critical analysis of all sound that enters it.
Also, I have always been a huge comic fan, and I have to say, I think extreme Good and Bad most certainly do exist in the real world. Comics are simply an artistic conveyance of the real world, much like any other art work, especially in the pop art world. Not trying to make this a discussion about evil or anything, but I live my life trying to ride the good side, and frankly, I would lose all self-respect if I allowed myself to slip into "bad" habits or the like. except for this bad habit of posting on forums!
Sum it up, If its not good, its bad.
Music is either good, or its bad. There is no grey area, and if there is, its probably bad.
I made no comment on Squarepushers music as a whole, I wouldnt do that. He certainly isnt horrible...I would never say that. I really like the guy, and his work. But that isnt going to stop me from critically analyzing what I hear. And especially when dealing with an artist who is known for his empirical precision, I found it shocking that such unrefined work would make it to his newest disc, which was lauded as his Dark Side of the Moon.
what makes a good ear is the subsequent critical analysis of all sound that enters it.
Also, I have always been a huge comic fan, and I have to say, I think extreme Good and Bad most certainly do exist in the real world. Comics are simply an artistic conveyance of the real world, much like any other art work, especially in the pop art world. Not trying to make this a discussion about evil or anything, but I live my life trying to ride the good side, and frankly, I would lose all self-respect if I allowed myself to slip into "bad" habits or the like. except for this bad habit of posting on forums!
Sum it up, If its not good, its bad.
I think the whole problem with this discussion is that computo made the comment: "He is a shitty drummer", and that in the same post it seems like this assumption is entirely based on one track on ultravisitor (that would be Circlewave, track 12) - which is an AWFUL track, with awful drums on it. I certainly took the remark that way at first.
So: Although I think s.pusher is a brilliant drummer: yes, the drums at least on that track are hideous. Everyone else: that doesn't mean he's an all-round sucky musician. Nor is this criticism directed towards you personally
On Music has rotted one note, the drumming style is somewhat similar, but way better executed, imo.
So: Although I think s.pusher is a brilliant drummer: yes, the drums at least on that track are hideous. Everyone else: that doesn't mean he's an all-round sucky musician. Nor is this criticism directed towards you personally
On Music has rotted one note, the drumming style is somewhat similar, but way better executed, imo.
mbp 2.66, osx 10.6.8, 8GB ram.
"Sum it up, If its not good, its bad."
which is ONLY the two extremes. im sorry you dont feel that there is any grey area in bwtn there.
you dont have to apologize for having a very different opinion then mine, it is by no means any more important than yours. i feel that with a subjective thing such as music or art its about taste and what strikes an emotional chord. im not against proficient musicians. im not all for chopless musicians but its all opinion in the end.
it is sad to me that for you there is only good or bad. if that track on ultravisitor to YOU is bad drumming and you see no merit in it, or any redeeming qualities that is fine, but i sppse i have bad taste.
which is ONLY the two extremes. im sorry you dont feel that there is any grey area in bwtn there.
you dont have to apologize for having a very different opinion then mine, it is by no means any more important than yours. i feel that with a subjective thing such as music or art its about taste and what strikes an emotional chord. im not against proficient musicians. im not all for chopless musicians but its all opinion in the end.
it is sad to me that for you there is only good or bad. if that track on ultravisitor to YOU is bad drumming and you see no merit in it, or any redeeming qualities that is fine, but i sppse i have bad taste.
second class robot
alright, dude, time to throw down or shut up.computo wrote:theres no question that tom is an amazing bassist, and programmer.
But if you guys REALLY want to defend the live drumming that appears at the end of Ultravisitor, then go ahead, you are the foolish ones.
I have played and studied drums for 20 years, including study and performance with Kenwood Dennard, Wynton Marsalis, and plenty of others... Im not going to post any recordings because I dont feel the need to prove anything to you people, and it wouldnt prove my point: that Ultravisitor BY FAR, has the worst drumming of any squarepusher album.
post some recordings(not to prove anything, but to share with the community)
i'll gladly match those samples with basslines that everyone (including you)
can also use as they wish.
you can talk shit alright as i've seen on the boards as of late
now can you walk the walk with me and give everyone something interesting
to use with ableton
d
I can be an Ass... all depends on my mood. Can you provide a more intellectual description of shitty drumming or is it limited to you just saying it is? And where are these tracks of yours so we can compare? I would love to hear some drumming that is not shitty!computo wrote:thats just asinineMoody wrote:Ok... I guess there should be no groove or swing to drums? I think that is a polar thought... can we not exist in parallels?
-
Ambioun - Techno Man
- Posts: 397
- Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2004 5:58 am
Well thanks to anyone that actually helped out and gave me a few ideas on the sound, but it got nowhere. I will probably have to experiment more.
And to everyone else. I could give a flying fuck whether squarepusher is a good drummer or not. Instead of ranting on about it, and ranting gets nowhere, maybe you should try putting something positive back into the community.
Thanks again to the people who tried to help with the original purpose of this thread.
Peace
And to everyone else. I could give a flying fuck whether squarepusher is a good drummer or not. Instead of ranting on about it, and ranting gets nowhere, maybe you should try putting something positive back into the community.
Thanks again to the people who tried to help with the original purpose of this thread.
Peace
ok, so because I said
"<he's> a shitty drummer as evidenced by some of those Ultravisitor tracks",
and
"thats right, hes a shitty drummer, or at least whoever that is playing live on the later tracks of Ultravisitor is a shitty drummer."
you guys extrapolated that I think
a) squarepusher completely sucks,
b) all I do is talk shit, and
c) I owe you some sort of sample bank of drum sounds for use with Live???
well I dont give away my work, but I will surely post some of my live performances on drums. I am trying to get my bandmate to send me the recordings of my old band, Mookomor, in which I played drumset, electronic drums, and programmed drums, all at once, and I will post it as soon as I can get it in my computer BELIEVE ME. The last thing I would want to do, is leave you haters thinking that you have anything to talk shit about. if you want to hear recordings that I have done that have all kinds of percussion, and drums and programming, check out my website, or myspace site, in the meantime.
www.computo.us
www.myspace.com/computo
Its so funny that you guys are so defensive, and demanding about this topic, especially since I am a squarepusher fan. I think his drum production is amazing, and yes definetly there are some good "live", yet cut drums on other tracks. And by the way, for you guys demanding examples of good drumming (try any James Brown album) or proof of ME being a good drummer, what does that have to do with the discussion of whether the drumming on track 12 of squarepushers album is any good??
"<he's> a shitty drummer as evidenced by some of those Ultravisitor tracks",
and
"thats right, hes a shitty drummer, or at least whoever that is playing live on the later tracks of Ultravisitor is a shitty drummer."
you guys extrapolated that I think
a) squarepusher completely sucks,
b) all I do is talk shit, and
c) I owe you some sort of sample bank of drum sounds for use with Live???
well I dont give away my work, but I will surely post some of my live performances on drums. I am trying to get my bandmate to send me the recordings of my old band, Mookomor, in which I played drumset, electronic drums, and programmed drums, all at once, and I will post it as soon as I can get it in my computer BELIEVE ME. The last thing I would want to do, is leave you haters thinking that you have anything to talk shit about. if you want to hear recordings that I have done that have all kinds of percussion, and drums and programming, check out my website, or myspace site, in the meantime.
www.computo.us
www.myspace.com/computo
Its so funny that you guys are so defensive, and demanding about this topic, especially since I am a squarepusher fan. I think his drum production is amazing, and yes definetly there are some good "live", yet cut drums on other tracks. And by the way, for you guys demanding examples of good drumming (try any James Brown album) or proof of ME being a good drummer, what does that have to do with the discussion of whether the drumming on track 12 of squarepushers album is any good??
+1Ambioun - Techno Man wrote:Well thanks to anyone that actually helped out and gave me a few ideas on the sound, but it got nowhere. I will probably have to experiment more.
And to everyone else. I could give a flying fuck whether squarepusher is a good drummer or not. Instead of ranting on about it, and ranting gets nowhere, maybe you should try putting something positive back into the community.
Thanks again to the people who tried to help with the original purpose of this thread.
Peace