former crack user, now owner

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
ethios4
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Post by ethios4 » Sat Oct 01, 2005 6:24 am

I've noticed that paying for software motivates me to use it more, study it, learn its secrets, and really try to get the most out of it. I started with Live using a v2 crack, but when I bought v3 when it came out all of a sudden I became absorbed in it, sitting up at night studying the manual, seriously developing a relationship with the software. It's a whole different deal when you've put money into it. The same with Operator...now that I've bought it, I use it all the time...much more than vsti's I haven't paid for. I feel good when I use Operator, much more inclined to really learn how it works. Other vsti's I'm more inclined to preset-surf and move on.
I feel like the best music I've made was created in a time when I only allowed myself to use Live's instruments and FX, and samples that I created myself.
Music is real. You can't steal it or crack it.

Johnisfaster, good for being honest :)

Johnisfaster
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Post by Johnisfaster » Sat Oct 01, 2005 6:15 pm

a few people mentioned that they thought it would be better if live was a timed out demo instead of a non saving demo. I think the reason they didn't set it up this way is cause it's reallly very simple to reset the ilok on timed demos. the copy protection live currently uses is almost fool proof from what I've seen. even cracks eventually stop working. which is brilliant and I respect them alot for being so genius about it. but timed demos would change all of that and people would just use a time reset.

honostly I think live should have an official poll to see how many of their current paid users used to use cracks. I think they would find that cracked software leads to alot of sales. that and if people could see that 10,000(random number) paid users used to use cracks but decided to pay, then people would be likely to join the band wagon and start paying. it's kinda like on the apple site where it says how many legal song downloads they have done. people join in possitive stuff like that.

mosca
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Post by mosca » Sun Oct 02, 2005 9:06 am

the copy protection live currently uses is almost fool proof from what I've seen. even cracks eventually stop working
yeah, and that's the only reason you bought it. don't bullshit us by saying 'it's worth every penny' otherwise you'd have bought 4 when it came out.

Q&A
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Post by Q&A » Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:49 am

mosca wrote:
the copy protection live currently uses is almost fool proof from what I've seen. even cracks eventually stop working
yeah, and that's the only reason you bought it. don't bullshit us by saying 'it's worth every penny' otherwise you'd have bought 4 when it came out.
Maybe if a software company doesnt protect themselves properly, they may deserve to have 8 year old kids cracking their program.

what difference does it make if that is the only reason that he bought it?

i bought mine :wink:

I like that post about moral codes, try before buy, etc.

I dont understand what you mean "otherwise youd have bought 4 when it came out."

Ver 4 cracks crap out after a few months too,....or so Ive heard.

I paid for Live because it is affordable, has everything I want right now for computer music, stable, affordable, I use it all the time, and its affordable.
All other progs that meet this critereia also get purchased.

Ok, lots of redundance in this post and thread. I think it should continue though. I am curious about all of your opinions.

One last thing. Honest people use crax, cheater type people do too. Honest people end up buying the crax, cheaters don't. I dont think it is justifiable to ridicule honest people who buy the software that they like. I also dont think it is ethical to be a software company who releases shitty programs that are riddled with bugs. Please dont yell at me for saying this stuff, I try to be as virtuous as I can on this harsh planet ruled by jungle law.

mosca
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Post by mosca » Sun Oct 02, 2005 12:42 pm

and i've bought mine since version 1.5 :D

the point is - if the crack was reliable and didn't crash, would people who use it actually purchase the program because it was worth every penny?

i doubt it very much, no matter how 'honest' you are.

i used a cracked version of Cubase for years, it was reliable and didn't crash. I made a bit of money from music and i could easily have bought a legit copy but chose to spend the money on other things as the version i had was fine and dandy.

there was a program on UK TV the other week about shoplifters and Gilette have set up an experiment (apparently Gilette razors are the most stolen item in the UK) to see if, even when confronted by the fact that the goods were stolen, people would exercise some kind of moral indignation and not buy the razors from car boot sales, markets etc.

they had a 100% failure rate, everyone bought the razors - even when a guy stood beside them and said 'they're stolen, there's a sticker on the front that says 'to be sold in shops only' one guy even said - who cares they're cheaper than in the shops.

human nature i'm afraid

3phase
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Post by 3phase » Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:18 pm

mosca wrote:
the copy protection live currently uses is almost fool proof from what I've seen. even cracks eventually stop working
yeah, and that's the only reason you bought it. don't bullshit us by saying 'it's worth every penny' otherwise you'd have bought 4 when it came out.
Live 4 was a money back issue for me... not a reason to buy a program.

I stil have Live 3 iinstalled..its nice...rock solid...quick..

Live 5 is the first one where midi actually is usable.
Every Live 4 user need that upgrade.

3phase
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Post by 3phase » Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:59 pm

mosca wrote:i used a cracked version of Cubase for years, it was reliable and didn't crash. I made a bit of money from music and i could easily have bought a legit copy but chose to spend the money on other things as the version i had was fine and dandy.
I really dont understand than why you be so critical and negativ

You should have bought a cubase when you was using it so regulary!

But i also was once in the situation where after my own law i would have had to buy a software.
But didnt..Actually i spend all my money for a nord modular instead buying 3 plug ins... I am bad :-(..
But actually ...i dont miss the plugs...But i would miss the NM.
Just in the moments you have to master something...Than some serious Eq´s come in handy.
I wish Live would have a propper EQ inbuild...
In the end EQ4 and EQ3 are fx... Nothing you like to use in the sum.

In the moment i dont have to feel guilty..OS X cleared the situation for me. And i think again about buying some xxxxx plugs...And earlier or later i will..They have deserved it over time..Even when they are too expensiv.

So you are maybe wright that too good hacks can lead to a situation where you just go on and have other prioritys. Especially things you dont use on a regular base like mastering plugs or deesser plugs tend to get never so important for you that you like to buy them... Used once in 2 years...
I however cant understand people that run on a hacked workstation...
Its just too much hazzle to work any day with something buggy.
Ok...this can happen with official software aswell :-(
But you get the cure quicker...

Apple computers somehow educate to buy software..When i compare my harddisk to others that use a pc...
Wow..
these people have software that would cost 30000 or more on theire machines..
And wonder why nothing works ;-)

Maybe apples stability is rather based on this than on technical items.

swpspce
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Post by swpspce » Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:07 pm

Johnisfaster wrote:no, but I expected not to be called stupid in the second reply of my first post. thats why I got upset to begin with cause the second replys entire attitude toward me was totally uncalled for.
not so...you have invited this all by your own doing...

what you want...a pat on the back and a firm handshake inviting you to the "Only mans club" for apparently doing something unethical and then deciding that maybe you should reach deep into your pocket...

get a life
Apple PowerBook 12" 1Ghz 512mb Ram...ReMOTE 25, Live 4 beta 4, Kontakt, Reaktor

Johnisfaster
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Post by Johnisfaster » Sun Oct 02, 2005 8:37 pm

I swear to god some people are just dicks by nature.
that and after a thread gets several pages long apparently no one takes the time to read through all the comments before they post their own.

mosca
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Post by mosca » Sun Oct 02, 2005 8:46 pm

if that was aimed at me - tell me i was wrong

Johnisfaster
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Post by Johnisfaster » Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:02 pm

if your point was that I would never have bought it if the crack worked properlly then you are wrong because you are forgetting that people buy software so that they can get free up dates and they can get tech help and use of forums and many other reasons. I bought it for all of these reasons as well as the fact that the cracks don't work (so sue me for admitting it) but it certainly isn't the only reason.

my point in the last post was that no one needs to be a dick about anything. seems like people could just disagree with you if they want but they don't need to be condescending and accusing when they do so. if you want to disagree with me thats fine but be nice about it everyone(not just mosca)

mosca
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Post by mosca » Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:13 pm

ok cool

hambone1
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Post by hambone1 » Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:53 pm

I doubt if anyone here of a professional nature uses cracked software.

There's no excuse for it, especially with the lenient demos that most software houses allow. Demo it, like it, buy it, use it.

I personally wouldn't garbage up my system with software cracked by some spotty bedroom geek. That keeps my system clean, streamlined, stable, and fast (for a Mac! :? )

I can't afford to jeopardize that just to save a few bucks, not to mention the obvious ethical issues of ripping someone off.

My opinion only.
Last edited by hambone1 on Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Johnisfaster
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Post by Johnisfaster » Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:35 pm

I agree to some extent, but as far as cracks messing up your computer I think that you really only have to worry on pc's mostly(which I've used for a long time) where as macs seem to be very stable and trust worthy no matter what you put on it. at least what I've seen so far. my pc hardly works anymore. the mac is running brilliantly.

FaX-01
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Post by FaX-01 » Mon Oct 03, 2005 12:12 am

Just for the record some of us tragic fucks actually sold all their hardware too fund a software change over and actually purchased professionally configured DAW's with legit software from the get go. :oops: 8O :lol: .
This propbably explains why my PC is rock solid IMHO.
After spending all that money a few years back I wouldn't risk putting anything unstable on my system.
Look at it this way if we where still living in a 100% hardware studio world 2/3rds of these people would not be making music of anykind unless they went window shopping with bricks.
I don't buy the crack arguement for one simple reason - FREEWARE.
If you can afford the PC and controllers you can afford at leasr one host.
Wether it be Traktion / Energy XT or one of the audio card suppliers who bundle a DAW with their product.
There is ENOUGH decent FREEWARE out there to get anyone up and running without the need for running cracks IMHO.

For example -

KarmaFX Modular
CoFx's - Rock & Ensembler
GreenOak's - Crystal
Klangerformer's - Rebel , Ninja & Sonic
Odo - Drummatic , SeeqOne , APAD
Synth 1
PAAX freeware sampler
AudioMulch in "time out mode"
Ext in demo mode only
MiniMogue VA
Smart Electronix Plug In's
Asynth
GVST's plug's
Fish Fillets
Glaceverb's Dasample
Luxonix LFX1310
etc etc...

Do I really need to go on.
Sorry warez do not make for better music.
I just don't buy the arguement that people NEED to run cracks.
You have options available that circumvent the need too do so.
Anything else is nothing more than an excuse IMHO.
I am by no means well off and am currently on a disability pension due to chronic illness and cannot work :(.
Financial hardship is no excuse either IMHO.
Maybe I'm the odd one out here ?
I still don't see the need for using cracks/warez myself.
My aren't the wings of butterflies beautiful and do they not make wonderful perturbations.....

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