new intel imac + live 5.03 tested

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
mg75
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new intel imac + live 5.03 tested

Post by mg75 » Sat Jan 14, 2006 5:39 am

tested the demo today.
iMac 20" intel 512mb ram
launched fine.
while playing the demo there were audio dropouts.
system performance was at 160% or more.

LOFA
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Post by LOFA » Sat Jan 14, 2006 5:42 am

8O

mcconaghy
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Post by mcconaghy » Sat Jan 14, 2006 6:15 am

That should probably give us the hint that Live doesn't work well under Rosetta on a fresh-out-of-the-box Intel iMac - and hopefully Ableton get the nudge nudge wink wink to break out that compiler and roll a universal binary asap.

FireForEffect
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Post by FireForEffect » Sat Jan 14, 2006 6:18 am

Hmm..seems like it should perform better than that. Even my crappy ole G4 isnt that bad.
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LOFA
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Post by LOFA » Sat Jan 14, 2006 6:24 am

I don't believe news this bad until I have heared it from multipple sources.

forgie
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Post by forgie » Sat Jan 14, 2006 7:07 am

I wonder if Rosetta eats up extra RAM.... if it does it might help to explain why the iMac crumbled with only 512MB.

I wouldn't really expect any 'real time' software to function properly under emulation - does anyone here use Virtual PC? You sure as hell aren't going to run an audio app in VPC, even on a quad G5.....

It's only bad news in that we have to wait for a f#%#ng universal binary from the Abes. Here's hoping that NAMM will be a good time for them announce it - perhaps Live 5.1? Fingers crossed.

On the upside we may all have to wait for Rev B of the intel macs, which would probably mean faster CPUs for the same price, not to mention... ahem... FW800 Apple?

kenn michael
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Post by kenn michael » Sat Jan 14, 2006 7:24 am

Even though Rosetta is not NEARLY as slow as Virtual PC, it's still not designed to run highly intensive multimedia apps...

It's supposed to be similar performance as a single proc G4 running at about 450MHz... That's fine for apps like Photoshop and Office, but maybe not for Live.

Think about how CPU hungry Live is compared to other music hosts because if it's 'always on - Live' design. I would think this would be very tough on something like Rosetta.

Apple's pro-apps (Final Cut, Logic, Motion, Soundtrack Pro) don't run well under Rosetta either - which is why they're saying - "Don't try it, it doesn't work. Wait for the Universal Binary update in March"

I personally wouldn't buy an Intel Mac right now and expect to get 'to work' with music apps. I, however, WILL be buying a MacBook just cause I'm an early adopter, and I have other G5s that I can use to get my music work done until Universal Binaries start coming down the pike.

LOFA
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Post by LOFA » Sat Jan 14, 2006 7:37 am

forgie wrote: On the upside we may all have to wait for Rev B of the intel macs, which would probably mean faster CPUs for the same price, not to mention... ahem... FW800 Apple?
These are the very details I am hung up on. It sucks tho', 'cause I feel like I have been waitig two years for a competitive mac-top. Oh yeah. I have.

forgie
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Post by forgie » Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:25 am

Yep, it surely does suck. But what are you gonna do? Personally, I won't be in a position to afford a PowerBook (MacBook Pro, sorry) for about a year or so anyway, so the Intel shift couldn't have come at a better time for me.

But it does suck. So do a lot of things though. The downside of being an mac user is the waiting for new technology thing.... when it comes it's fantastic, but it can be a painful experience if you really want to make good use of it.

subSonik
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Post by subSonik » Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:28 am

Think about how CPU hungry Live is compared to other music hosts because if it's 'always on - Live' design. I would think this would be very tough on something like Rosetta.

Live doesnt support dual-core processors either. Im sure that doesnt help. The Abes gotta do something about that too..

SUb

FireForEffect
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Post by FireForEffect » Sat Jan 14, 2006 9:38 am

This especially sucks because I have gigs coming up and cannot use my present system...I was more or less counting on a new mac..grr..now I have to find a solution quickly. I wonder if I could gig with a mac mini in the meantime until the Abe's get it together?
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nobbystylus
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Post by nobbystylus » Sat Jan 14, 2006 11:01 am

Hopefully by the time the MacBooks come out (probably end of Feb) Live and Reaktor etc will be at least universal binary, and we should see the boosts from the current G4 1.67s to Intel 1.67/1.83s. When Ableton will (if they will) go fully multithreaded for Quad/Dual/Core Duo optimising is anybody's guess though.

I'm thinking more and more of waiting til at least April-May, maybe til Rev B, and thinking of seeing if there is a bargain on a iMac G5 floating around for my studio stuff now.
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hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Sat Jan 14, 2006 11:08 am

I wouldn't expect a universal binary before march 2006.
How can the abes test it, if none of those macs are shipping yet?
Blind faith? we all know where that got us......

freshdrumma
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Post by freshdrumma » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:51 pm

i will buy a seecond hand pb or imac g5 for your coming gigs, and i will hang on my 1,25 pb untill things doesn't realy work well, becouse the problem it's not only live, live can be universall, but what about the third party pliugs that i'm using, i don't need a very fast computer that can run 10 Vsti and some great reverb if, the reverb and the vsti aren't also
universal ...

aex1
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Post by aex1 » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:59 pm

its no surprise rosettas performance sucks, it emulates a G3 processor at a much lower speed than the processor its running on. results may vary, but from what i read anything realtime is out of question.

not even steve jobs himself seemed to be too confident about the perofrmance, on the keynote he demoed photoshop on rosetta, commenting on how obviously slow photoshop starts up and then merely doing some "layer on/off" clicking to demonstrate that it basically does work. his conclusion was the performance may not be good enough for the (small) group of professionals, but will be ok for the rest of us, haha. everybody knows how photoshop is mainly an amateur app, and hardly used by pros .. and i mean if even steve "reality distortion" jobs admits that a product might leave something to be desired, it definitly must suck big time.

the even worse news is that even when you have universal binary app running, loading additional code thats ppc - like plug ins - will either not work, or switch the app back to rosetta. you cant have ppc plug running in a unversal binary sequencer.

as for live, remember a bugfix-list of some v5 beta where it stated that a bug was fixed causing live not to start up on intel machines. so i assume that ableton are indeed working on the unversal binary. i think the abes had a lot of time to test it since developers could get an intel-mac developer machine from apple, half a year ago when the intel thing was anounced. no need for blind faith. so i expect live to run on intel macs pretty soon, the problem are the non ableton plug ins. if you get an intel mac you just have to wait until all of them are available as universal binaries as well.
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