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 Post subject: Hardware v. AU Synth
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2003 4:05 pm 

Joined: Wed Feb 19, 2003 11:19 am
Posts: 18
Good Afternoon All,

Yesterday I was in Guitar Center playing with the Novation K-Station. I can't decide if I should buy the K-Station (hardware) or the V-Station (software).

Live2 is my only sequencer and I am running it on OS 10.2.6. I don't want to spend the money on the hardware and I don't want to buy Logic or DP just to run AU synths and effects.

My Question: Is there some free AU host that has rewire support or is there any word on a Live update that will support AU instruments in the future?

Thank you much!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2003 6:44 pm 

Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 7:22 pm
Posts: 214
Location: NYC
You definitely need Reason. Reason is the only program that Rewires into Live OS X at this point. It's also the most incredible synth/sequencer I've ever used. You have incredible versatility once you get this program. i was reluctant too at first, waiting for a free or cheaper Virtual Synth to come out for X (Plogue Bidule being the most promising) but I couldn't wait anymore and I have never once regretted purchasing Reason. Now I have a consolidated setup, I only need to use 2 programs that communicate with each other beautifully, and I've got complete synth creativity (perhaps Reaktor gives more versatility, but it may never rewire into Live).


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2003 8:33 pm 

Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2002 1:28 am
Posts: 1195
Location: santa barbara
i use reason too, but if you're just looking for synths, don't get reason. the synths sounds like shit on their own.

as far as free au hosts, there's rax, but it doesn't support rewire.

http://www.grantedsw.com/rax/index.shtml

i'm not sure if max/msp for osx supports audio units, but if it does, then i'm sure someone will build a rewire host soon enough.

k


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2003 8:42 pm 
i've got a k station and love it--it has tons of great sounds, 400 patches, and you can tweak til your hearts content with all of the knobs and sliders. It is also a great Live controller, all of the knobs and sliders come in very handy. If you don't have a midi controller and are looking for good synth sounds, the k station is a great choice. Not to mention that it will save cpu, possible crashes and other mulitple app mishaps, and I find it much quicker to instanly switch patches on the k station than it is to shuffle around between vstis, or between instruments in Reason. DS is right, if you buy reason for some great synth sounds (or realistic versions of real instruments) you will be let down. Not that reason isn't great and fun, but k station sounds will definitely be fatter and more "analog" than most reason sounds (but then again the k station doesn't have a "piano" sound, or any other attempts at acoustic instrument simulation). Good luck

Ryan


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2003 9:03 pm 

Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 7:22 pm
Posts: 214
Location: NYC
Well, I haven't used the K-station but have used quite a few analog synths (Juno 106, Akai AX60) and Reason just blew those away for me. I usually just create my own patches out of the pure sine wave in Subtracter and I get great variety...and the Synth Sampler modules are great if you need real instrument sounds...
In my opinion Reason is what you make of it, but out of the box it's true, I wasn't inclined to use most of the sounds it came with. But to me, the great thing about it is the ease with which you can make your own patches. I'm more into the Virtual instrument as a pure instrument where you should be striving for sounds you can't get out of real instruments.

Dunno, I'd say try out the demo and decide for yourself! Maybe I'll get to a Sam Ash and play with a K-station.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2003 9:21 am 

Joined: Tue Dec 10, 2002 8:19 pm
Posts: 247
Location: Sweden
I have a K-station and use Live a lot. I also use Rax (mentioned above) a little together with Audio Hijack. And I also use Reason.

The K-S I play live right into Live. So I use it mostly for arpegiator, bas, pads and melodies. When they are easy to play.
The K-S sound is OK but I dont think its as good as some say doing analogue sounds. But its a beauty when it comes to tweaking. Think of a sound, grab the knobs (no mouse clicking here!) and make it right. Its very well laid out.

Rax with Audio Hijack I use very little. But its ok if you want to try out some new AUs and find something you want to use in a project.

Reason I love. Much because its a good combo with live. Its two different worlds in perfect match. You got everything you will ever need. Lot of sounds, effects, analogue seq, drums, percusion, samples. In perfect sync.
I dont like programming the synths though. Often I find something that is almost right and then I make a few changes. But Its not very fun using the mouse.

>I would suggest you get the K-S though. Especially if you love programming sounds. And also if you intend to play without the computer sometimes. The alternative would be the Novation V-station + Remote25. But I have not tried that.

C


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 Post subject: reason is great
PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2003 4:26 pm 

Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2003 11:45 pm
Posts: 134
I agree that Reason is what you make of it.

I have created other worldly sounds in that program that I have NEVER heard elsewhere. At the same time, it is true that without tweaking the synth patches are not very good.

But did you really want to use presets anyway?

Look at it this way: Reason is user friendly enough where it is dead simple to make your own patches and arpeggiated patterns (though if you like, you can download, say, the Virus arps) AND you'll be guaranteed that no one else has a sound just like yours.

Live and Reason are a match made in heaven. It is truly exhilirating to use them together because you have EVERYTHING at your fingertips you could possibly need to make incredible sounds.

I will fill you all in on the functionality of the remote 25 when it arrives next week... Anyone have any experience yet with the R25 + Reason/Live?

Now if only the looped sequences problem in Reason could be fixed (where it misses the first beat of the looped section).......


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2003 4:42 pm 

Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 7:22 pm
Posts: 214
Location: NYC
Alright, good to know I'm not alone in my sentiment! That R25 looks amazing. I've settled on a lower end Edirol PCR30 for my Reason control. I'm also getting the Evolution UC-33 to control Live when that comes out. That's ultimate control if you ask me. You won't know the difference between hardware and software!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jun 07, 2003 4:56 am 

Joined: Wed Feb 19, 2003 11:19 am
Posts: 18
Thanks everyone for your responses! I am amazed at how many are using Reason with Live. I thought about purchasing Reason.

Even though I would make my own sounds (I can't stand presets) I was afraid I would still sound like everyone else because so many people use it.

I have been using Csound but it is so tedeous (am I a programmer or a musician?) that I only use it when I need to construct some really out there stuff.

Thanks again. Everyone's input has been very good.

- forgive


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