I just copped a new MPC 1000 and......

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
WaveRider
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Post by WaveRider » Sat Apr 15, 2006 1:44 pm

deckme(N)tal wrote: and quantizing and swing really works...it means that when you record something with quantized enabled it places the hits in the right way...
trust me....
I would agree, as with hardware I did quantize a lot and it never seems to work well with Live, as quantized results seems wrong most of the time.

steve-o
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Post by steve-o » Sat Apr 15, 2006 3:20 pm

Well, I had a 1000 and barely used it. Personally, I don't understand how it takes 25minutes to make a beat with Live. I use Impulse, microtonic, simpler, and simple old clips. I'd like to get Stylus RMX one day, guru and maybe battery. To get a pumping sound try saturator and compressor II with the trackteam aduio beatbox livefill preset "Pump Lows" on a send. Place Colortone free before it. Route all drum tracks to the send using "send only". Be creative and route different drum tracks to different saturator/compressor combos. If you want add vintage warmer with the heavy preset, or BBE somic maximizer, or whater your favorite plug is. Tweak. Bang- massive pump.

Seriously, there is so much more you an do with Live than the 1000, even with the new OS. Maybe it takes longer to learn, but there is no quick fix. Routing, effects, sends, resampling - Live is so deep.

Also, listening to lots of old hip-hop, my impression is that they used loops in addition to hits. I'm not saying that MPC's don't have there own groove (although I never understood what all the fuss was about), but sample a break or a riff or a back beat, and groove will be there. I myself record without quantization, and if I need to fix things do so afterwards.

Remember - groove is in the heart (couldn't resist).

ajstrax
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Post by ajstrax » Thu Apr 20, 2006 6:44 pm

Just curious - are people sleeping on guru? I used to have a 2000xl and I found that it took long (for me anyway) to drop a beat. So, I bought guru and trigger finger and I wouldn't go back. In my opinion, it's pretty much the same thing as the MPC except quicker and more versatile (again, my opinion). Can anyone list off things that MPC's do that cannot be replicated or done on, say, guru?

I'm wondering why guru isn't getting too many props? I think it's tight.
Live 6, MV8800, Moog Phatty, Guru, KRK Rokit 5's

snowtires
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Post by snowtires » Thu Apr 20, 2006 7:05 pm

steve-o wrote:Well, I had a 1000 and barely used it. Personally, I don't understand how it takes 25minutes to make a beat with Live. I use Impulse, microtonic, simpler, and simple old clips. I'd like to get Stylus RMX one day, guru and maybe battery. To get a pumping sound try saturator and compressor II with the trackteam aduio beatbox livefill preset "Pump Lows" on a send. Place Colortone free before it. Route all drum tracks to the send using "send only". Be creative and route different drum tracks to different saturator/compressor combos. If you want add vintage warmer with the heavy preset, or BBE somic maximizer, or whater your favorite plug is. Tweak. Bang- massive pump.

Seriously, there is so much more you an do with Live than the 1000, even with the new OS. Maybe it takes longer to learn, but there is no quick fix. Routing, effects, sends, resampling - Live is so deep.

Also, listening to lots of old hip-hop, my impression is that they used loops in addition to hits. I'm not saying that MPC's don't have there own groove (although I never understood what all the fuss was about), but sample a break or a riff or a back beat, and groove will be there. I myself record without quantization, and if I need to fix things do so afterwards.

Remember - groove is in the heart (couldn't resist).
i agree. the only reason i got an mpc in the first place was because i didn't want to bring my laptop with me to gigs. programming on it (the mpc) is simple enough, but i wouldn't go as far as to say it's worlds faster. you can record a beat just as easily if not MORE easily on a computer than you can on an mpc. mpcs are like protools, everyone uses it because it's the 'industry standard' and there are some die hards fans who will support it to their dying day, but to people on the outside, its popularity doesn't really make all that much sense - there are much better ways to do things.

djadonis206
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Post by djadonis206 » Thu Apr 20, 2006 7:14 pm

Having had and sold the 2000xl and the 1000 I get it but I don't then

honestly

I had a dream

this guy showed me how to really use the MPC - which was merely writing and beat on the MPC then recording the loop into pro-tools

I woke up and was like I need to go get another MPC then I thought

wait, that was a dream

I have a track I did with a MPC (only) up on my www.myspace.com/teknolife page - it's called DRUMS - the others are Ableton related
Ableton | Elektron

Music

huffcw
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Post by huffcw » Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:04 pm

RopeyPunter wrote: I dont know if there is anything bad about live's timing, but its certainly mentioned quite a bit. It makes sense to me that if mpc has a higher resolution for reading/writing midi notes then the rumours are probably closer to truth than fiction. Course I dont know which has a higher res, if at all .... hopefully someone will discover this and let us know.
The MPCs all have much much lower MIDI resolution compared to any computer program. Directly from the MPC1000 product page - the resolution is only 96ppq.

A lot of other hardware sequencer have much higher resolution - and pretty much all software does. Maybe it's the lower resolution that is helping to make it tighter (e.g., you can be more sloppy with your playing, but since it is at such a low resolution it's not going to be noticable.)

By the way, other programs, like Sonar, allow you to adjust the MDID resolution. I am not able to find a way to adjust Live's resolution.
Last edited by huffcw on Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

4ace
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Post by 4ace » Thu Apr 20, 2006 8:21 pm

ajstrax wrote:Just curious - are people sleeping on guru? I used to have a 2000xl and I found that it took long (for me anyway) to drop a beat. So, I bought guru and trigger finger and I wouldn't go back. In my opinion, it's pretty much the same thing as the MPC except quicker and more versatile (again, my opinion). Can anyone list off things that MPC's do that cannot be replicated or done on, say, guru?

I'm wondering why guru isn't getting too many props? I think it's tight.
Yeah fill me in on this "guru".....Got a link to it??

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lola
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Post by lola » Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:58 am

I can understand why u choose an mpc.
Even my old akai s950 and emu sampler sound much better compared to the clean harsh no so dynamicly sound of a digital host.
I think its the sound where the kick comes in, it inspirates,

b0unce
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Post by b0unce » Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:49 pm

the mpc is a great 'performance' sampler, for doing live stuff and just jamming. In the studio while producing, there are many ways to sample etc

steve-o
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Post by steve-o » Fri Apr 21, 2006 5:01 pm

lola wrote:I can understand why u choose an mpc.
Even my old akai s950 and emu sampler sound much better compared to the clean harsh no so dynamicly sound of a digital host.
I think its the sound where the kick comes in, it inspirates,
Tru - I might get a MPC 60, 3000 or old akai sampler if I ever get loads of cash or have the time to deal with that again. But a 1000 doesn't sound like those old machines at all. For the current crop of MPC's the sound issue is all hype. Go AB it it for yourself.

Yeah I want guru when it comes out as universal binary. But I'm tellin y'all you can get phat sound out of Live real cheap. To get real good swing, groove, etc, turn quantize off as well. Work on your own timing.

huffcw
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Post by huffcw » Fri Apr 21, 2006 6:13 pm

A couple of things to consider about Live's MIDI resolution:

1. Currently ppq can't be adjusted in Live. I have seen people who use Sonar report that adjusting Sonar's resolution down to 96 ppq makes it feel more tight like a MPC when programming beats.

2. If you use a MIDI USB interface you are asking for issues. Many USB interfaces have issues with latency and unstable timing - so that could be a source of MIDI issues rather than Live itself.

b0unce
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Post by b0unce » Fri Apr 21, 2006 6:35 pm

hence playing your beats into an mpc, and taking that midi file to your computer (if you want to apply the same groove to your soft-drum-sample-machines) is a good thing.

huffcw
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Post by huffcw » Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:27 pm

b0unce wrote:hence playing your beats into an mpc, and taking that midi file to your computer (if you want to apply the same groove to your soft-drum-sample-machines) is a good thing.
If you have the luxury of owning one - it is great way to program tight beats. However, it's not good for all material.

At only 96 ppq, an MPC is quantized by default and does not allow for as much of a give and take human feel as a sequencer that has much higher resolution. So, it is very good for beat oriented music (e.g., dance, hip-hop and techno) - but not as good for other types of music (including anything in a non-even time signature). It's also not good for sequencing other instruments - which you usually want to have more give and take in the timing.

By the way, I am not sure why Live does not allow adjustments to the ppq setting like other sequencers. There are other benefits I have heard from users of other sequencers...lowering the MIDI resolution can help with the strain on your computer and sometimes can remedy sync issues.

b0unce
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Post by b0unce » Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:35 pm

ya, and like you said - the lower ppq is essentially quantization by default - would be nice to have the option to set the ppq in live and see if its the same in practice as it is in theory. It might make your beats 'limited' but I think these beats make a good 'skeleton' for more intricate percussion, if you took the lower ppq groove into a higher ppq environment.

deckme(N)tal
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Post by deckme(N)tal » Thu Sep 21, 2006 10:34 am

i just installed the new independent os 1.0....and now i have got autochromatic, chop shop, grid edit, multiple pad change....it is becoming a beast (my mpc!) :wink:

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