WAY OFF TOPIC - Computer Science / IT

[djadonis206]

So this is off topic but since most of you / us are pretty aware of what's going on in the world as far as Information technology / networks / Systems etc

I'm taking the pre req's for the IT department at the community coolege now and this summer - but the actual classes for the programs start in Fall - alot of the classes in the IT department overlap so you could be be in the Web Development program now and switch to Programming later

so I'm signed up for the web developement program at the moment but after doing some research I'm leaning towards Programming or Network Design and Administration (CISCO something or another)

So my goals in life are to make lots of money, move to a country other than america and write jams Carl Cox and Dave Clarke and Dan and Donald chart on a weekly basis - oh and keep my options open to transfer to a four year college

So basically my question for all you guys in the industry what's the best route to take

Programming, Network design? Web Development - future wise what's going to be the thing, what makes more money, what will give me the time to keep up my real job as PIMP OF THE YEAR ON THE 1's and 2's (I'm kidding - I want to still have time to write music and dj from time to time)

I appreciate the discussion because you guys seem to know alot more than me about alot of thing

Adonis

[stinky]

Alright, alright...

Being a IT Consultant for 10+, i can tell you, having starting out in Sys Administration, that if you want time for music, and what not, stay away from network administration. My .02.. you'll make decent money, but not +70, unless you've been in IT for +3 at the same job, with a bunch of certs... Besides that, Network Administration can do a number on your afterhours.. meaning, alot of times, if the network's down, it's up to you to fix it... alot of that stuff can't be done during normal hours, unless it's mission critical.. which means, 24/7 support, and calls at all hours, plus driving around...

Yes, i know it depends on your place of employment, but you'll have to do the research, and if you don't want to put in hours like that, you'll be at the lower end of the totem pole, taking shit from management...

Or, you can work for a small company (<20 employees), which will wind up making you the go to guy, less money, less hours... but, that's not guaranteed...

My advice, go more toward programming (but that requires a high aptitude in math and logic, not for everyone), or web design (which requires a high aptitude in creativity and design)...

Having learned the hard way, i'm more inclined to use all my skillset now, which moves me into internet media consulting (including web design, internet marketing, and the like), but i have way more time for myself, and alot of the time, it's better that i work from home...

The best thing is to find a way to telecommute... that's the best thing!! You wind up being the most productive, and you don't have to deal with management as much.

[sqook]

So my goals in life are to make lots of money, move to a country other than america and write jams Carl Cox and Dave Clarke and Dan and Donald chart on a weekly basis - oh and keep my options open to transfer to a four year college

So basically my question for all you guys in the industry what's the best route to take

Programming, Network design? Web Development - future wise what's going to be the thing, what makes more money, what will give me the time to keep up my real job as PIMP OF THE YEAR ON THE 1's and 2's (I'm kidding - I want to still have time to write music and dj from time to time)

You're not going to like my advice, but I think you should stay out of IT if these are your sole reasons for getting into it.


First of all, it's not 1990 anymore. People aren't going to toss you a cushy job straight out of school just because you have a computer related degree. The market for good IT jobs is still tight, because there are still a lot of talented in the job pool since the dot-com boom, but demand has decreased. It's still a very useful degree to have, of course, but you need to face the reality that you will either be applying for good paying jobs at reputable companies (in which case you will face plenty of competition), or an easy-in job with a clueless company in search of people slightly more computer literate than themselves (in which case you will be treated like shit).

Secondly, if you are in serious pursuit of a programming degree, you should love programming. If you go into it lured by the prospect of big money, you will end up hating yourself for it later -- trust me. I went to school with a lot of people like this. A small minority finished their studies and actually became decent coders, some of them dropped out, and the rest of them figured out how to coast through it and then wind up at a job where they end up in middle-management because they have no real technical skills. The market is already flooded with people that just know how to "talk the talk", and often those people end up becoming dead weight. Even worse, after a few years of working in the business, you'll end up hating your job and your life, and bouncing around various positions and companies.

So, if you love computers, technology, and are interested in learning how to code, then great... go for it! Take a bunch of different classes, explore different topics, and then focus on something that catches your eye. Where your passion is, money (and happiness) will follow. Just don't get involved for the wrong reasons; you'll regret it later.

[djadonis206]

Hey thanks - I forget about the guys who have to work on the weekends here when the system goes down etc etc

Programming or stay on the course I'm on - Web Development

I love math - that's not a problem and I'd like to think I'm somewhat creative

I hate management

thanks man!


anyone else in the trade?

edit - adding some thoughts

I'm just a little skeptical about Web Development all of a sudden - can I make money to live, will I be able to go other places and work?

It seems programming is more universal or worldwide if I might say

[stinky]

You're not going to like my advice, but I think you should stay out of IT if these are your sole reasons for getting into it.


First of all, it's not 1990 anymore. People aren't going to toss you a cushy job straight out of school just because you have a computer related degree. The market for good IT jobs is still tight, because there are still a lot of talented in the job pool since the dot-com boom, but demand has decreased. It's still a very useful degree to have, of course, but you need to face the reality that you will either be applying for good paying jobs at reputable companies (in which case you will face plenty of competition), or an easy-in job with a clueless company in search of people slightly more computer literate than themselves (in which case you will be treated like shit).

Secondly, if you are in serious pursuit of a programming degree, you should love programming. If you go into it lured by the prospect of big money, you will end up hating yourself for it later -- trust me. I went to school with a lot of people like this. A small minority finished their studies and actually became decent coders, some of them dropped out, and the rest of them figured out how to coast through it and then wind up at a job where they end up in middle-management because they have no real technical skills. The market is already flooded with people that just know how to "talk the talk", and often those people end up becoming dead weight. Even worse, after a few years of working in the business, you'll end up hating your job and your life, and bouncing around various positions and companies.

So, if you love computers, technology, and are interested in learning how to code, then great... go for it! Smile Take a bunch of different classes, explore different topics, and then focus on something that catches your eye. Where your passion is, money (and happiness) will follow. Just don't get involved for the wrong reasons; you'll regret it later.

Listen to this man... he knows the industry... I can't tell you how many people i've worked with that are complete morons... don't know shit technically, and they have degrees...

IT is hard... the IT world constantly changes, and it's on par with medicine for how much you really have to keep up on technology DAY to DAY... otherwise, you become a dinosaur very quickly.. Keeping up on new technology takes a pretty decent chunk out of every day (at least an hour)... That alone means that you're constantly chasing to keep up with advancements... and if you're in multiple fields, like i am, it can be really daunting... i spend roughly 10-12 hours a day on the computer.. between music, consulting, designing, reading journals, posting emails, and various other things, it's hard enough to keep track of the news..

My ex thought i was nuts, which is why she's my ex... unfortunately, she was more of a distraction, the a benefit...

[David]

Programming or stay on the course I'm on - Web Development

Try both! see what one you like the best and focus on that one. I like doing both, but I'm addicted to coding at present, its such a huge topic and there is always more to learn, so if your brain is always looking for the next problem to solve then go for programming. If your more creative visually you'll probably do better at Web development.

I agree with what the sqook said, you have to like what your studying or working in or else it just wont happen. On the other hand, work is work and no job is 100% magical, most people dont enjoy every aspect of their jobs, there is no magical place over the rainbow, that is life, so i feel you are right to choose something which will give you a good income, its just common sense.

Anyway, good luck!

[Kodama]

I've been an IT dude for about 10 years now.

You have to practically be married to someone to get a job in many places.

As far as programming, everyone wants you to know every single language ever maid and get their laundry and make their coffee.

It's sad, but you're only bet corporate wise is probably to embrace the M$.

If you're a consultant, you can write in whatever you want, as long as someone can sell it!

[kennerb]

Adonis - look at it this way. Network plumber = pager 24X7, change control; which means anytime you want to make a simple configuration change or reboot a machine you have to push a stack of paperwork through ranks of bureaucracy (most who have no clue about what you are doing), and the need to stay around and do things when the network load is light ie, midnights on the weekend (right when you want to be out clubbing). The money is not like what was possible in the early 90's

Web Dev = staring at a computer for ever (wait we already do that ), Programming skilz (gotta love some kinda coding at some level or you'll hate life). Keeping up with the hot technology of the day. The upside is that you can do a lot of the work on a mobile computer from anywhere that you want (given that this is allowed )

They are both super competitive and demand a lot of hours.

gotta go my pager just went off. . .

[ultrasource]

I chose the IT path and now I have two cell phones, one of which alerts me whenever any *critical* system is down on six different properties (all connected wirelessly). When I get home at night, I can't turn off work and I always feel connected and enslaved. I feel less human and have no time for music BUT I can pay rent. I also can only speak in acronymns and it's getting on my gf's nerves. Fuck I need a life.

[joesapo]

Here's what I think...

I've been doing the Systems/Network administration gig for about 4 years now. Been in IT as a pro for 8.

Yes, it requires some hours at night and on the weekends... But if you set your systems up right and you're not on an enormous constant-maintenance network or something, this should be minimal.

I've done programming professionally and I've done sysadmin'n. The developers where I work are always two steps behind whatever project and trying to bust azz and do 12 things at once. Not me...

Why I like Admin'n vs Developing:

1) Cutting edge uber-expensive hardware - programmers don't get to mess with $150,000+ sun servers - plus my PC is always da shiz

2) The users are your bitch - some might think this is the other way around, but that's just an illusion admin's like to put up. YOU are the man.

3) Attention span - like so many ADHD kids w/o their aderol, I'd go crazy if I had to work on the SAME GODDAMN PROJECT for 3 years (my work).

4) The DOWN TIME - This is what it's all about. Once everything is setup how you like it, you still have to go to work 8 to 5. With nothing to do there, what do you think happens all day???? Uhhhh... I'll let you figure it out.

Yeah you only get noticed when things break... but you DON'T get notice when things are working.

[ishimaru]

Become a mac expert and find small businesses to demo a machine running all of there stuff flawlessly. Play up the savings from not having a FT IT dept. lol. I told the managing partner at the last firm I was at I could save them 200k in salaries alone by switching to apple lol.

[MrYellow]

Computer science = complete waste of time.

Theory and practical are 2 different things.

Had computer science grads telling me not to do this and not to do that....
I turn around and say "dood, I do this 50 times a day and have never had
a problem".

-Ben