Question for those using MPC with Live

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
ajstrax
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Question for those using MPC with Live

Post by ajstrax » Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:33 pm

I've been debating on whether or not to buy an MPC. However, I've looked into various tutorials, etc. and I notice that most dudes using the MPC's use that to sequence their chops etc to get them to fit whatever BPM or tempo they want to track to sit at (record into PT or cubase, usually). I was watching that Pete Rock utube vid and he chopped up his sample and sequenced it (he said the mp lets you fit your samples to any bpm etc).

I may be wrong here, but I don't see the use for the MP (here's where I need your opinions) considering that Live does all of the time stretch (with warp markers). I can then simply chop in arrangement view and arrange and mess with the samples.

One thing I would like to do is avoid having to turn on the PC each time I want to mess around with ideas. What's the deal with the MPC and Live? Am I totally off base here.

I don't want to be a gear ho.....you know...

Thanx
Live 6, MV8800, Moog Phatty, Guru, KRK Rokit 5's

kuniklo
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Post by kuniklo » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:28 pm

Live is 10x more powerful than the MPC. The whole point of the MPC is the integration of the interface and the sampling engine. It's just a different way of working and leads to different results.

Personally I *much* prefer working out beats on the MPC but it's very much a subjective thing.

If you're really curious buy a used MPC1000 and work with it for a month. By that time you'll know if you like it and you can resell it for close to what you paid for it if you don't.

Adonis
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Post by Adonis » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:36 pm

kuniklo wrote:Live is 10x more powerful than the MPC. The whole point of the MPC is the integration of the interface and the sampling engine. It's just a different way of working and leads to different results.

Personally I *much* prefer working out beats on the MPC but it's very much a subjective thing.

If you're really curious buy a used MPC1000 and work with it for a month. By that time you'll know if you like it and you can resell it for close to what you paid for it if you don't.
good point - the only real reason I could myself getting an MPC is for gigging or something like that

check out the www.mpc-tutor.com forum and ask around about how heads are using the MPC and LIVE <-- believe it or not that's how I got turned onto LIVE - through the MPC forum

You can definately do it all in the MPC, and it's fun and sounds great - but I found it way easier and faster to do all the same stuff in LIVE...it would be nice to have a MPC, a couple Electribes, a killer synth, a sampler and nice sidechaining compressor again - but my place is only so big now ;)
Last edited by Adonis on Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kuniklo
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Post by kuniklo » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:40 pm

The MPC is also a pretty decent midi sequencer. I like to use it to sequence synths along with it' own sample-playback.

Again, Live trounces it in terms of features but working without a big computer screen forces you to use your ears more instead and leads to different results. It's a major PITA to edit midi on the MPC so you're forced to play things right the first time which can actually help build your keyboard skills and lead to more musical results than micro-editing 4 bar takes in Live.

Sequencing softsynths in Live with the MPC is a lot of fun. Particularly with the note repeat function.

scientist
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Post by scientist » Fri Oct 27, 2006 5:10 pm

i'd say don't get an mpc for chopping and matching loops to tempo. live is way easier to use and more flexible for that. my advice is always that the mpc is for performance, so if you're a drummer/percussionist and want to play your beats instead of sequence them (or want to learn) then go for it. but if you normally just program your parts, its not worth it.

ajstrax
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Post by ajstrax » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:17 pm

Thanks for the headz up guys. I hear all of your points. Here's my thing: currently, I use Guru with Trigger Finger because I prefer working out my beats with the a step sequencer (like guru's). I don't like programming my drums in Live (for some reason, I just like step sequencers). The thing is that my Sampletank and trilogy and stylus all have great kits that, until recently, I thought could not be accessed by an MPC.

Recently, I saw a vid on the FP site where some dude was using a 1K via midi link. He had the channels set up so that the mpc controlled the different channels in sampletank (or whatever VST synth). That's what I've been looking for the whole time (I THINK) - which is to sequencing the sounds of my vst's using a step sequencer.

Guru does not allow you to access your vsts! What about this man? Am I taking out of my *ss here or am I right? :) Let me know since dudes here have good experiience...

I agree that Live is the only way to go for the chops, timestretch, etc....

THAnx...
Live 6, MV8800, Moog Phatty, Guru, KRK Rokit 5's

kuniklo
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Post by kuniklo » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:25 pm

You can use the MPC just as a midi sequencer for software drum samplers. The MPC sequencer isn't anything like the Guru sequencer though. The whole point of the MPC is *playing* your beats out instead of programming them in. If you just use it for midi you're also going to lose the sliders, note repeat, and 16 steps features of the mpc, at which point it really just becomes a glorified drum pad.

If your preferred method of working out beats is a dedicated step sequencer like Guru's I'd suggest you just work out your beat in Guru and then drag & drop the midi clip into live and use it to play the kits you want in Stylus or Sampletank or whatever.

stale bread
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Post by stale bread » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:31 pm

get a mpc-1000 if you dare..... they are really cheap and there is a third party operatiing system available for them that really enhances their value 10fold, matter of fact os 4.10 just came out yesterday, that added among other things realtime time stretch etc.... scientist knows what he's talking about but I have a different take on it. I would definately get one for programming as well as performance but the features it has are great for studio production... I see you have Guru, Rmx, battery and a triggerfinger plus Live. I have all of those things myself, but the mpc-1000 is much more fun than guru, rmx, or battery and much more intuitive than all of them too.
they're great apps don't get me wrong, gurus main inspiration was the mpc, if you look in your guru content folder you'll see some beats from me. but still those apps are not to where an mpc is yet even though they have features that far surpass an mpcs standard features.

Now.. the mpc and ableton Live make a 'potent as fuck' combo. Live has no sample slicer :? and before you say wtf I already said it! if you're just going to sync loops together then the MPC's slicer won't do anything for you
but if you're going to really slice things up and rework them Live will do it but the mp will do it quicker and much more fun.Gurus slicing is not as good as the mpc either.
the real cream is using both Live and the mpc as an extension of one another.
you know you can assign clips in live to your midi controller and record your pad play into the arrangerview right?... well imagine a hardware box that has
64 pads and each of those pads has the power and features of a Live clip, envelopes, fx, all of that. thats what an mpc-1000 can do, it can be your front end and Live your back end and you can sequence all of your live clips with the mpcs sequencer and record your compositions to Lives arranger view.
Mac, Mpc, and a Microphone

Thanks for the Slicer Abe.

scientist
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Post by scientist » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:35 pm

yeah, mpc is not a step sequencer. there is a grid editor in the new 1000 os, but its all done on the little screen so you're much better of with guru. if you want a step sequencer you should look for something like an electribe. very easy to use step sequencer on those, but they can be a little short on features...everything's auto quantized and constant velocity on the pads.

ikke
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Post by ikke » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:35 pm

ajstrax wrote:Thanks for the headz up guys. I hear all of your points. Here's my thing: currently, I use Guru with Trigger Finger because I prefer working out my beats with the a step sequencer (like guru's). I don't like programming my drums in Live (for some reason, I just like step sequencers). The thing is that my Sampletank and trilogy and stylus all have great kits that, until recently, I thought could not be accessed by an MPC.

Recently, I saw a vid on the FP site where some dude was using a 1K via midi link. He had the channels set up so that the mpc controlled the different channels in sampletank (or whatever VST synth). That's what I've been looking for the whole time (I THINK) - which is to sequencing the sounds of my vst's using a step sequencer.

Guru does not allow you to access your vsts! What about this man? Am I taking out of my *ss here or am I right? :) Let me know since dudes here have good experiience...

I agree that Live is the only way to go for the chops, timestretch, etc....

THAnx...
you dont want to step sequence midi on an mpc. its a pain in the ass! get an mpc if you want to lay down ideas fast with pads/keys.. without a computer. Otherwise use your computer or buy a rack sampler. The midi sequencer on ANY mpc is very limited. If you can make twisted beats on the mpc, you can make nice beats on pretty much everything!

.. ANother good idea is to get an ASR for the crunch n crispy sound (think Blockhead) . ASR´s are very cheap... and get a dedicated midi sequencer with more options. Grab a Trigger Finger and you have more power than you would have with just an mpc. Ensoniq sounds GREAT
Last edited by ikke on Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

stale bread
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Post by stale bread » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:36 pm

the mpc 1000 has a great step editor, I like to bang on the pads but the new operating system has some very nice grid/step editing, the 1k and Live have a great symbiotic relationship
Mac, Mpc, and a Microphone

Thanks for the Slicer Abe.

stale bread
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Post by stale bread » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:40 pm

another thing is this. you can still use those other apps too, for instance I think that the mpc and guru should make a kickass combo too, especialy if you like step sequencing, you could stepseq with both and switch between them, sequence gurus 'scenes' with the mpc and gurus got 8 engines you can do some dope shit with that combo
Last edited by stale bread on Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mac, Mpc, and a Microphone

Thanks for the Slicer Abe.

ikke
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Post by ikke » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:41 pm

"the mpc 1000 has a great step editor, I like to bang on the pads but the new operating system has some very nice grid/step editing, the 1k and Live have a great symbiotic relationship"


yeah i have an mpc4000 buts still.. its very limited compared to modern sequencers. its cool and i love it , dont get me wrong, but dont excpect too much cause youll be limited if youre used to Live

scientist
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Post by scientist » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:42 pm

stale bread wrote:the real cream is using both Live and the mpc as an extension of one another.
amen. its the combo that works for me. there are just certain things that are better on one than on the other, so i jump back and forth between all my gear depending on what suits things best. the bottom line for me is that of all the equipment in my studio (which isn't much really), the mpc is the one thing besides the piano that gets the most use. my advice is this: buy and try it and if you don't like it sell it on ebay and buy the next thing on your list.

stale bread
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Post by stale bread » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:46 pm

that's a good point see the 1000 has better slicing than the 4000, maybe the step editing that jj put in there is better than the 4000s too i don't know
but my friend who won't use anything but his 4000 wishes he had the 1ks os in it.

he's certified in protools and nuendo, uses logic as well, but loves his 4000 to death, he didn't want anything else until he saw jjs os.
Mac, Mpc, and a Microphone

Thanks for the Slicer Abe.

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