should i move to ableton? (deejaying)

MrTiddles · Post by **MrTiddles** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 2:09 pm

212121 wrote:thanks for the reply!!!

i was thinking that a audio-interface was a sound-card + a midi-controller, aren't there products like this?
i still don't understand where i connect the audio-interface for output, does it have xlr output for the speakers? or i need to have a mixer (and connect the audio-interface to the mixer)? looks like i need to keep the mixer

i could try to buy a xone 3d it it would do all work (audiocard, midi controller and mixer) but i also want to produce in reason and fl so i think i need a "midi keyboard" and if used a xone 3d i would have no controller if i play in a club or somehwere else, unless i bring the mixer with me lol

The main trouble when making the switch is what gear to get. Including the cost of the custom enclosure, My performance setup is getting on for about £4k! It really depends on your budget. A couple o' hundred quid will get you a Behringer BCR2000 and a half decent soundcard. You also gotta make up your mind about doing it all on a PC and MAC. If your starting out, PC is probably the best way to go. If you want reliablity though, go for the MAC. I use PC for writing tunes, iMAC for performing. But getting definative answer about which way to go relies more on your tastes and budget than any other factor.

I guess what I'm saying is.......read the Ableton WIKI, then once you know what you can do, buy the kit accordingly.

Mr Tiddles

geofferd · Post by **geofferd** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:02 pm

Dude 212121

From my experience ableton is a great DJ tool but i dont think it can offer the same satisfaction and fun than spinning tunes on your decks can. I just got some CDJs and a djm400 delivered last week and never spun on them before, within afew hours I realised i would never use ableton to DJ with again. It is just so much more fun having to keep 2 tracks locked together with your hands rather than moving warp markers around.

Also a big factor I think is if you are planning to mix entireley with ableton no external audio mixer you lose alot of character in the sound. I have connected my powerbook to a DjM600 in a club and the sound was so much brighter going through the mixer than just from laptop.

Another thing i have had problems with is the crossfader in Ableton which has no curve adjust i have never liked the way it sounds. Also no matter how good a soundcard you have i think there is always going to be a tiny latency which when doing really chops on the cross fader i think you can `feel` the latency.

I will still keep goign with ableton for producing and doing re-edits of tracks to play on the CDJs but as for djing with it I was never really happy with the result.

Adonis · Post by **Adonis** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:19 pm

I know the feeling ^^^^

I spent some quality time with my computer and turntables this last weekend and discovered (again) I prefer the pitch control to the warp

tracks sound better when they're not warped - but rather spun

I turned the turntables off and fired up Live - the tracks sound awful (especially parts when there's no beats) - just a bass or a lead line...you can hear this warble - but if I had a proper controller this might make things a little bit more fun - but at the moment I don't

I'm seriously considering getting a CD-J - I have Torq which is nice and it's hard to go back to actual vinyl cause my high bit rate mp3's sound awesome but...

It's no mystery I'm not on the "Go Ableton DJ" team

but I bet with a proper controller, a nice mixer and your own tracks to throw in the mix it can be a lot of fun

peace

a

geofferd · Post by **geofferd** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:32 pm

Good man adonis, go for a cdj man you will not be disappoined! i used to spin with vinyl on 1210s which was fun, but the CDJ is so much better, not having a jumpy needle is a blessing!

I dont think the cdj1000s warrant the extra £500 for a pair so i just went with 800mk2. and if your in the usa man you can get pioneer kit alot cheaper than the uk.

robin · Post by **robin** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:32 pm

Adonis wrote: I turned the turntables off and fired up Live - the tracks sound awful (especially parts when there's no beats) - just a bass or a lead line...you can hear this warble

Try repitch or complex warp modes.

To assess whether Live is the DJ tool for you, you _need_ to find a controller that you are comfortable with. Otherwise you'll feel like you are djing with one arm behind your back (and look like you doing it while reading email).

That search isn't easy which is why I suggest trying a few of the cheap controllers first to get a feel for what you need.

Also remember the computer keyboard can be mapped to loads of useful things within Live.

That said I do still love mixing with vinyl. I've been mixing with Live for 18 months and decks for somat like 13 years. It's natural that I'd feel most at home behind turntables.

Adonis · Post by **Adonis** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 4:44 pm

Yes, I agree with a proper controller (the perfect controller) DJing with LIVE can be something else

I've often considered trading my decks in for a couple pairs of CDJ 800's and nice new DJM but it's so haard to imagine a world (i.e. my studio) with no technics :(

but it is a day dream I'm seriously considering

peace

a

robin · Post by **robin** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 5:01 pm

I'd like a CDJ800 just so I know how to deal with Pioneer cd players but when I look at the cost I always just give up thinking about it (I don't have a CD player at home, just my laptop).

Also, whilst it's getting better, a lot of the places I play don't have CD decks either.

Live on my laptop with a little controller and audio interface means I'm self-contained. I like that.

paolo topaz · Post by **paolo topaz** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 6:14 pm

I went 100% ableton for Djing at first i.e. playing all my tunes off it but lately I've found using two cdj 1000 mk3s and a 1210 or two brings back the performance and keeps your mixing sharp.

i've also found it useful to shup up the doubters who think you can't dj cos your just using a laptop, and it is true that people don't like seeing a dj stare into a screen so i've found this works well for me. i buy all my tunes of beatport so the pitch doesn't drift like records so getting in and out of cd to Ableton is easy enough as well as layering loops and efffects from Live on top of tunes off cd.

My set up is M-audio audio phile(no probs at all) M-Audio Trigger Finger(great for bangin samples and loops) And Evolution Uc33e(great dj style mixer)

I was very impressed when LIve allowed you to change the direction of the midi control to adjust the master tempo so I set up a fader on the Uc33 to speed it up I mve it towards me just like on a technics, I even have the tempo range set at 8% like a 1210.

if you ride the pich and don't touch the record when you play vinyl I think you''ll find incorporating Ableton and using it as another deck vvery easy

Why not keep Serato and use Ableton with it like Hawtin???

My only real advice would be Get LIVE asap, it's savage!!!!!

Paolo

p.s. I run my audio out into a spare schannel into the mixer but I always find the gain lower than cd decks or technics, I never go above 0db on my master output in live. Is this normal or my oundcard settings?

paolo topaz · Post by **paolo topaz** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 6:17 pm

Live on my laptop with a little controller and audio interface means I'm self-contained. I like that.[/quote]

it is great having total control over set up and all you own effects and not depending on club gear. The only downside is last christmas I was getting calls from mates at house parties at six in the morning telling me to come out and plug in to home surround system and play!!

robin · Post by **robin** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 6:21 pm

it is great having total control over set up and all you own effects and not depending on club gear. The only downside is last christmas I was getting calls from mates at house parties at six in the morning telling me to come out and plug in to home surround system and play!!

Ha ha yeah I get that too. Advantage is that having a HD full of tunes, my range of styles is much bigger than if I had the same bag that I'd just played the club with.

Another reason why I love Live.

212121 · Post by **212121** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 6:55 pm

the xone 3d really does all i need (audio card + midi controller + mixer) but then i would have to take it to play in clubs lol i don't think i would like to show up in partys/clubs and set up a new mixer, ohhh.... and the other deejays would also be using my own mixer. and i also said that i would like to start producing in fl and in reason so i need a midi controller with a "keyboard"

212121 · Post by **212121** » Mon Nov 13, 2006 7:06 pm

for example something like

m-audio ozonic
http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Ozonic-main.html

novation x-station
http://www.novationmusic.com/enlargepicture.asp?id=82

it has EVERYTHING i need for ableton live and for producing, right? then i just have to connect the outputs to a normal mixer!

Adonis · Post by **Adonis** » Tue Nov 14, 2006 1:17 am

robin wrote: Try repitch or complex warp modes.

Thanks - the complex mode sounds waaaaaay better

I'm running utilities over each track to mono them out - for some reason it sounds tighter

I'm mixing now and what do you - it's fun

I'm gonna look into a quality controller this weekend

a

212121 · Post by **212121** » Tue Nov 14, 2006 12:31 pm

after reading some reviews in other websites it looks like the xone 3d isn't that good.
what about this:
m-audio ozonic
http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Ozonic-main.html

novation x-station
http://www.novationmusic.com/enlargepicture.asp?id=82

??? are there better ones? those already have a soundcard and i could also use them in reason or FL to produce (they have a keyboard), right???
and i can connect it to my xone 92 mixer and use them with live, right?

212121 · Post by **212121** » Thu Nov 16, 2006 7:08 pm

can anyone else help me please?

what do the black pads in a controller like m-audio trigger finger do??? i know what knobs and buttons do lol but whats the point of those pads that you press with your finger? http://www.harmony-central.com/Newp/200 ... ger-lg.jpg

thanks