If you could have only 10 new features in Live 7...

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Mon Apr 02, 2007 6:14 pm

hoffman2k wrote: I hope they just drop this whole "xxxxxx has this feature so Live should have it too..." nonsense.
Or "since the dawn of ages, DAWs have had xxxxxx. Get it in the next live update...".
At least the Cycling news is a good sign.
its fine that the cycling news pleases a certain set of users but please don't refer to other users wishes as somehow pointless meaningless quibbles / whinges.

I use DAW features every day, I think it's legitimate for me to ask for tools which will make my tasks either easier or at least possible. If you don't use these features please do not belittle them, it annoys me a lot.
I hope they just drop this whole "xxxxxx has this feature so Live should have it too..." nonsense.
firstly 'they' is me.

secondly many requests aren't because another app has this function it is because this function is a good function to have. We don't want multiple automation lanes, or signature automation, or in-place editing, or folder tracks because cubase has them but because they are good tools. Live IS a DAW, can anyone dispute that?

thirdly "nonsense" .
hmm. I think you mean "I don't use it, so I am calling you all fools"

hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Mon Apr 02, 2007 6:35 pm

Angstrom wrote:
hoffman2k wrote: I hope they just drop this whole "xxxxxx has this feature so Live should have it too..." nonsense.
Or "since the dawn of ages, DAWs have had xxxxxx. Get it in the next live update...".
At least the Cycling news is a good sign.
its fine that the cycling news pleases a certain set of users but please don't refer to other users wishes as somehow pointless meaningless quibbles / whinges.

I use DAW features every day, I think it's legitimate for me to ask for tools which will make my tasks either easier or at least possible. If you don't use these features please do not belittle them, it annoys me a lot.
I hope they just drop this whole "xxxxxx has this feature so Live should have it too..." nonsense.
firstly 'they' is me.

secondly many requests aren't because another app has this function it is because this function is a good function to have. We don't want multiple automation lanes, or signature automation, or in-place editing, or folder tracks because cubase has them but because they are good tools. Live IS a DAW, can anyone dispute that?

thirdly "nonsense" .
hmm. I think you mean "I don't use it, so I am calling you all fools"
Not at all...
My point is, I bought Live because of the "LIVE" part.
Not because it had the potential to become as good as xxxxx.
I'm only opposed to features that require offline processing. Because i'm of the opinion that there is a real-time alternative to most things.
Crossfading samples for example.. A process that could take place on the cue track.

Your examples about automation and folder tracks don't fall into the category of features i dislike.
They're improvements that i dont mind at all.
I could see lots of use for them in Live.

Its stuff like mp3 rendering i'm opposed to. Thats an example of one of those features in xxxxx that often gets requested and only contributes to the downfall of sound quality.

Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Mon Apr 02, 2007 6:41 pm

fair enough, although I'm not sure about the crossfading using cue.

When I use crossfades they are to blend one long sample into another on the same track. Often I have several tracks which do this, perhaps 3 or 4 in a usual ambient peice. Cue crossfades can only simultaneously crossfade two tracks (between each other) I need crossfades on one track, four times. If that makes sense.

If I use the cue 'crossfader' to crossfade a sound over 5 seconds I would need two source tracks and a destination track which holds the track insert effects.

hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Mon Apr 02, 2007 7:15 pm

Angstrom wrote:fair enough, although I'm not sure about the crossfading using cue.

When I use crossfades they are to blend one long sample into another on the same track. Often I have several tracks which do this, perhaps 3 or 4 in a usual ambient peice. Cue crossfades can only simultaneously crossfade two tracks (between each other) I need crossfades on one track, four times. If that makes sense.

If I use the cue 'crossfader' to crossfade a sound over 5 seconds I would need two source tracks and a destination track which holds the track insert effects.
I didn't mean Abletons crossfade.
But I didn't exactly mention details of how I see this to work.

Imagine you could select the samples you want to crossfade. Be it 2, 4,... samples
Multiple selection by shift-clicking.
Now right-click on any of those samples and select "crossfade".
A panel pops up out of the sides with a visual interface that lets you mix the samples. I imagine it would look similar to the pro-tools crossfade window.

The process itself CAN take place on the cue track. Or directly sent to another audio port.
(thats for the real-time example, nothing prevents you from doing it "normally" as an offline process on the master audio track)

Its far from perfect and I know there are a few holes in this logic.
But then again, its a start.

If Ableton wasn't looking for feedback, then we wouldn't be having this conversation on their forum.
If I tend to get a wee bit too emotional about this software some times. Then keep in mind that its only because I've put my heart and soul into this app and most of the projects related to it.

zloo
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"playthrough automation clips"? anyone?anyone?

Post by zloo » Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:33 pm

one Main thing for ME: "automation clips"?

...something that would replace the need for Dummy Clips
and clean up the rerouting that needs to be done when trying
to fade a complete piece of music playing in a previous scene down with just a key press, then perhaps fade back up again, without restarting the clip, aka song.

so...some sort of play-through clip, that would enact automation on a previously playing clip, would be FABULOUS
...and rock the theatre world.

Myriad77
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Post by Myriad77 » Fri May 18, 2007 6:49 pm

In no particular order:
1. Improved MIDI export options-Export as type 0 or 1 from tracks in a set
2. Ability to render all tracks as separate audio files in one pass
3. Live devices made capable of receiving MIDI program changes
4. Tempo nudging (DJ style)
5. Native side chaining with key listen on both compressors
6. Proper nameable markers
7. Proper audio editing tools usable over multiple tracks in arrangement view
(for multitrack drums etc)
8. Customisable keyboard command templates i.e ability to save several and
recall them at ease
9. Ability to save MIDI key assignments as templates within the library
10. Better control and viewing of the 'manage files' facilities
It's Live Jim, but not as we know it.

LOFA
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Post by LOFA » Fri May 18, 2007 7:19 pm

SubLik wrote:2) : Someone has already mentioned this & I think It would be great if you could view all fx inserts simultaneously like in Cubase/Logic on the mixer itself.
Being an experienced Live user I can say that I could greatly benefit from this. I will add though, that part of the reason I am more experienced with Live than Logic is that all of the extra windows in Logic are what drove me to Live in the first place.

This would greatly benfit me though, because especially now that automap has taken such a powerful role in how some performances are done, sometimes I (and I am sure others) think about actually devices, and clicking on them to select the blue-hand i very similiar to back when I was only doing audio based sets, and clicking on clips.

To paraphrase, whereas when Live was more about audio, say before midi was implemented, the two screen paradigm (session/arrrange) were great. Even through 5 I thought they were enough. Now, however, that we has multicore support, racks, device-selctable-automapping, and a growing user base that is more interested in developing, music from virutally scratch, on the fly, and with midi, being able to view our device-chains side by side would greatly enhance our mobility, especially when performing.

It could theoretically cut out some of the awkwardness of how screens are selected/changed, when trying to navigate without a mouse.

Mr Man
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Post by Mr Man » Fri May 18, 2007 7:42 pm

I wish you could have indipendant instruments/effects per scene

Like if i had an impulse on track 1, simpler on track 2 for scene 1

then scene 2 have a different impulse on track 1 and also on track 2

similair to changing patterns on korg electribes!

LOFA
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Post by LOFA » Fri May 18, 2007 8:05 pm

Mr Man wrote:I wish you could have indipendant instruments/effects per scene

Like if i had an impulse on track 1, simpler on track 2 for scene 1

then scene 2 have a different impulse on track 1 and also on track 2

similair to changing patterns on korg electribes!
You can. Just put each in the same rack and set them up opposingly in the midi options. Then all you need is to toggle between them.

tribewalker
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Post by tribewalker » Fri May 18, 2007 8:41 pm

2) : Someone has already mentioned this & I think It would be great if you could view all fx inserts simultaneously like in Cubase/Logic on the mixer itself.
I think i mentioned this perhaps in another forum ( or here in a different post ) but at least some kind of breakout window thing that actually lists what effects are tied to what channel/sends and if they are currently ON or OFF or maybe Automated.

Im not going to put my .02 in, as i see these posts all the time, and well.....it sometimes makes me wonder if ableton even really cares.......not that ableton isnt great ( its quite nifty! ) but in the end, ableton cant please everyone and who knows if they are even gonna try to please ANYONE , being the case. Does that make sense?

anyways, i guess i sorta put my .02 in anyway...meh.
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fzero
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Post by fzero » Fri May 18, 2007 8:50 pm

Meef Chaloin wrote:1) fades on clips (cubase style)
You can do this with envelopes!
Meef Chaloin wrote:3) more than one viewable automation line at once
4) groups that work with a solo
(...)
6) an instrument you dont have to pay extra for
7) slicing function somehow
Yes, please. I would like those too.

LOFA
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Post by LOFA » Fri May 18, 2007 11:56 pm

1) Storing meta-data about instruments/devices when freezing, so that a one track set with 20 diverse clips could be distributed to 20 unique tracks, unfrozen, and with the original devices in place.

2)New devices, I agree with Hoffman2k. I like to keep things internal while making my chains. It's very clean, and I like ableton devices. I own sampler and operator because of this.

3) A slicer. I would gladly purchase version 7 if it had a slicing utility. I might purchase it as an extra device. Though it would have to be effective.

4) Along the lines of a slicer, I like the idea of sliceable warp markers, but it would be best if we could manage which warp-markers sliced, and which ones did not. There is a lot of potential here for a smoother editing workflow.

5) Audio-midi file generator. Basically something that would enable me to get notes out of a bass-texture I made utilizing Sampler. It would be very helpful in terms of of the ease of generating efficient output.

6) Editable support for mice with lots of buttons. I would love to be able to navigate around the grid utilizing only mouse buttons, and not the cursor.

7) It would also be ideal if there was an option to switch between clip views (wave/piano roll vs devices) using a specific assignable toggle button.

8 ) when assigning midicontrol to loop lengths on clips, I feel that there are not enough practical options. I wonder if there was a way of creating/modifying the logic so that it had similiar navigational abilities to what is achievable utilizing the command/control and cursor keys.

9) Internal, dynamic utilities to assist in creating effective side-chaining results. Vague, I know, but making very obvious, implementable ways of using side-chains amidst all of this rack wizardry could really freshen things up. I am still seeing the racks as both a golden opportunity riddled with algebra problem. Sidechaining could be like the foil-method that makes factoring easier. Now I do get great resuts with the racks, but it's still a young, foreign technology that can evolve to be even more effective, and intuitive.

10) More features for sampler. I like it a lot. I never would have expected it. Please surprise me some more!

koneko
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Post by koneko » Sat May 19, 2007 9:58 am

REAL TIME AUTOMATION RECORDING in SESSION VIEW
!!!
please please

eyeknow
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Post by eyeknow » Sat May 19, 2007 10:11 am

fzero wrote:
Meef Chaloin wrote:1) fades on clips (cubase style)
You can do this with envelopes!
Meef Chaloin wrote:3)
4) groups that work with a solo
(...)
6) an instrument you dont have to pay extra for
7)
Yes, please. I would like those too.
I'm sorry, I'm confused......

a. can do this with envelopes...I guess I'm not sure of the "posting" or the "poster".........does this have to do with in/out only or are you referring to "audio" crossfades.........? I think I understand the envelope thing.......but isn't that limited to "clips" vs. arrangement?......or have I had too much to drink?

b
more than one viewable automation line at once
great idea, but let's please not implement new "issues and bugs" when doing so..........(other hosts seem to have problems when doing this)

c.
slicing function somehow
somehow, I'm not sure this will ever be done OTHER than an external editor (zero-x for me pc, audiofinder macintel)......

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