Take the Sweetjesus Duende vs Waves SSL blind test

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live

Which sounds better?

Mix A
6
21%
Mix B
23
79%
 
Total votes: 29

sweetjesus
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Take the Sweetjesus Duende vs Waves SSL blind test

Post by sweetjesus » Fri Apr 13, 2007 12:49 pm

hello

i've tried to mix a stem using the Waves SSL and the Duende.

they dont have the exact same functions on the controls so ive done my best to match the dynamics and let the differences in the two compressors stand out.

As you may hear there's not a lot of difference.

I sometimes can't tell the difference, but at low volumes and slightly less friendly or more revealing environmnets do show the Duende as being a little tighter/smoover but at loud volumes it can get hard to differentiate.

If you go here:

http://www.fridge.net.au/duende

...you can find an A and B file. I won't say which is mixed with which (one is done by the SSL Duende and other with Waves SSL) on the mixbus.

Which do u think sounds better?

Zerobae
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Post by Zerobae » Fri Apr 13, 2007 12:58 pm

To me Mix B sounds more 'sculpted' (better).

(Sennheiser HD650 from the iBooks internal out)

peeddrroo
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Post by peeddrroo » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:10 pm

sounds the same on my laptop's speakers.
maybe you should add this option to your poll...

b0unce
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Post by b0unce » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:28 pm

from the iBooks internal soundcard to a pair of Sony MDR-V900 headphones, they sound nearly identical...Boom-bo-dap-bo-do-waaaah, that kind of dirty bassline bit, the waaah sounds a wee bit smoother on the B track. Unless my mind is playing tricks on me...they sound very alike to me and I'm searching for differences

if this is really an A/B between waves/duende (and not a trick, two identical wavs etc)....based on this test I dont think its worth an extra $2000 for a duende...


I'm gonna try with a pair of shure e5c's next
Well, with the e5c's I hold the same opinion...they sound identical to me, when I really try and find a difference I'd choose the B track...but I'm not sure, there's no obvious difference to my ears.... mind tricks maybe
spreader of butter

sweetjesus
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Post by sweetjesus » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:38 pm

pierre, the reason i posted this test is that i dont have all the $$ in the world and well yeah $2k is a big chunka change and i too couldnt hear a lot of difference.

i did the mixes we went out to eat and when i got back, it took me 4 passes on both before i could start to hear the difference.


just to clarify this is a comparison of the stereo compressors.

the eq's im starting to get familiar with and i can say that they are completely different beasts.

the Duende's EQ's as so different to the Waves ones i dont think i could do a fair comparison between the two.

jb61264
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Post by jb61264 » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:39 pm

These sound absolutely the same to me on my Wharfedale Diamond 8.2 Pro-Active's...are you sure you didn't post the same file to A & B?
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sweetjesus
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Post by sweetjesus » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:39 pm

b0unce wrote:from the iBooks internal soundcard to a pair of Sony MDR-V900 headphones, they sound nearly identical...Boom-bo-dap-bo-do-waaaah, that kind of dirty bassline bit, the waaah sounds a wee bit smoother on the B track. Unless my mind is playing tricks on me...they sound very alike to me and I'm searching for differences

if this is really an A/B between waves/duende (and not a trick, two identical wavs etc)....based on this test I dont think its worth an extra $2000 for a duende...


I'm gonna try with a pair of shure e5c's next
Well, with the e5c's I hold the same opinion...they sound identical to me, when I really try and find a difference I'd choose the B track...but I'm not sure, there's no obvious difference to my ears.... mind tricks maybe
i promise no dirty tricks (unless i fucked up) but i think what it's coming down to is a slightly beter compression (slightly) on the Duende and frekkin heaps better EQ on the duende.

i gotta think if 2k is worth it in EQ's for me.

the DSP factor sux, it doesnt relieve as much cpu as one would like.

sweetjesus
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Post by sweetjesus » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:43 pm

jb61264 wrote:These sound absolutely the same to me on my Wharfedale Diamond 8.2 Pro-Active's...are you sure you didn't post the same file to A & B?
yup just did a phase inversion test and the two are not identical

b0unce
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Post by b0unce » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:45 pm

sweetjesus wrote: i promise no dirty tricks (unless i fucked up) but i think what it's coming down to is a slightly beter compression (slightly) on the Duende and frekkin heaps better EQ on the duende.

i gotta think if 2k is worth it in EQ's for me.

the DSP factor sux, it doesnt relieve as much cpu as one would like.
ya, the dsp factor does suck....but, why dont you drive your audio buffer to the max, wont that release some cpu ?

it might be like comparing chalk and cheese, but if you get a moment can you post an A/B of the eq's on similar settings, just out of curiosity ?

for EQ alone, I think I'd spend $2k on a quality outboard Eq, and a couple of high-end natives
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dom
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Post by dom » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:46 pm

strange, try phase cancelation against each other and the bd and snare are completely gone, bass and hihat stay...
also i pushed a.wav by 0.5db because they're not normalized and b.wav is slightly louder...

cheers,
d.
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Nod
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Post by Nod » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:46 pm

sweetjesus wrote:i promise no dirty tricks (unless i fucked up) but i think what it's coming down to is a slightly beter compression (slightly) on the Duende and frekkin heaps better EQ on the duende.
Any chance you could post something a bit longer/more detail?

microlive
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Post by microlive » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:57 pm

Mix B sounds best for me... better rounded. Mix A'a not bad... just sits to a little to high in the FR. But at the same time, i don't think it's $2000 worth of difference. Listening to them on Some KRK Rockit V8's... coming off an M-Audio FW410 & mixing desk combo....

LeifonMars
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Post by LeifonMars » Fri Apr 13, 2007 2:05 pm

I wasted my pair of fresh ears on this one... got sort of stuck in. At the beginning I was very certain that the world of sample B captured by my pair of K271 was for that decisive tiny bit closer and clearer than sample A. But as I kept listening and wasting the virginity of my ears, I lost the sense of decisiveness. And now, tinnutus is all that is left. But if the cause is right: I would do anything...but I won't do that.
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sweetjesus
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Post by sweetjesus » Fri Apr 13, 2007 2:25 pm

dom wrote:strange, try phase cancelation against each other and the bd and snare are completely gone, bass and hihat stay...
also i pushed a.wav by 0.5db because they're not normalized and b.wav is slightly louder...

cheers,
d.
dom thank you, mathemtics stuff isnt my strong point

i did try and match things by ear so to be .5 db off isnt too bad an effort ;-)

my mate helping me out with the testing (also sux at maths ;-) ) and he wanted to add something to your observation.

the cancelled result is not just the same track with the snare and kick missing, but there is a definite filtered sound which is due to the non linear differences across the frequencies.

my personal take is also that there is some subs left in there too.

@microlive, just read u mixed on Rockit 8's, i used rokit 6's and bluesky mediadesk 2.1 and the differences are more noticable on the bluesky's as opposed to the rokits.

itook4lefts
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Post by itook4lefts » Fri Apr 13, 2007 2:31 pm

to me, mix sounded more, i dunno "detailed". but i'm an unrepentant hobbyist, so youmight not want to take my word for anything (and my soundcard's a heap of steaming turd).

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