why is recorded audio so bad?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
4am
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why is recorded audio so bad?

Post by 4am » Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:37 am

hi,

i'm wondering what i'm doing wrong...

the recordings of my electribe mx simlply suck. when i listen to the recorded tracks and to the original it has nothing to do, in terms of presence, warmth and dynamics.

i use a multiface II at 44.1 - 24bit

any comments/suggestions?

thanks

a.

minimal
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Post by minimal » Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:42 am

what's the chain? Do you go directly from electribe into RME or is there something in between?
Good cables?
Do you record in live? try recording in wavelab or similar and A/B the files.

4am
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Post by 4am » Thu Apr 19, 2007 8:20 am

hi f.,

yes i go directly from the electribe outs to the rme, with brand new (good) cables...

i will try to record in soundforge, but i don't find normal that the quality is so bad... really nothing to do with the original :?

Johnisfaster
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Post by Johnisfaster » Thu Apr 19, 2007 9:36 am

just a shot in the dark, maybe you think it sounds bad cause it sounds quieter? sometimes thats the case that when you're monitoring your recording you hear it loud but then it records low and you playback at low volume and it sounds "bad" to you.

or you might accidently be recording in mono.

or you might be clipping and not noticing it.
It was as if someone shook up a 6 foot can of blood soda and suddenly popped the top.

4am
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Post by 4am » Thu Apr 19, 2007 9:47 am

thanks for replying:
no mono, and no clipping :cry:

it is a lot quieter...
it hasn't the nothing to do with the sound i hear when i route the mx directly to the monitors...

i thought it was because of the resolution of the recording, but i read that almost everyone here uses 44.1 - 24bits as me...

i will try to record in soundforge, or in my old HD recorder and then import the tracks in live....

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Post by Johnisfaster » Thu Apr 19, 2007 9:50 am

it is alot quieter, you just said it.

most people hear something quieter and it automatically translates as worse. try turning up the recording to the same volume you heard when you recorded it. I'm willing to bet money that it sounds the same when it's at the same volume.
It was as if someone shook up a 6 foot can of blood soda and suddenly popped the top.

4am
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Post by 4am » Thu Apr 19, 2007 10:11 am

i did not find the right words to explain.....
by a lot quieter i mean that there is not the same "pressure" in the sond... the bass has no "relief" and when i tune the volume it just gets louder but has not the same deepth

i'm going home for lunch now, i will try again with "fresh ears" and let you know later

rikhyray
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Post by rikhyray » Thu Apr 19, 2007 12:31 pm

I already answered but somehow my message disappeared.
Did you check the routing, I remember there are FXed and no FXed options.It might be that , otherwise here my impressions about the box.

While I liked using it live I never used any of recorded MX, nothing about volume lvevels just it never sounded good enough, strange that in studio or on stage it was fine but somehow it didn't translate to "tape" that well
I used same rates and even same card as you do, keep all my MX material in archives but more as reference.
Except for some purely commercial, bread and butter productions- fitness music never used MX for serious stuff.
OK I am very picky about sound, what pleases me is Clavia G2, Evolver, Revolution,now even Reason 3,Korg Legacy( though this one I use sometimes) collect virtual dust since I got those bad boys and girls. However must admit that I liked the live sound of MX, why it does not translates so well in recording ? No idea but I can confirm your impressions.

4am
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Post by 4am » Thu Apr 19, 2007 12:38 pm

ok i made some more testing:

with a "fresh and objective listening" i could spot a less important difference, so in part you are right (lucky i didn't bet big money on that) but it still lacks of deepth and it is really less defined.

now i suspect that it could depend on the fact that i tried to add some more swing (never enough for me) by letting the warp on....

i will try to disable everything and take the time to compare with the recordings made with soundforge...

anyone using hardware preamps to record electronic devices?
worth trying?

rikhyray
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Post by rikhyray » Thu Apr 19, 2007 12:44 pm

In this case -RME- you are fine, some big buck converters wont make that much of difference. Warp definitely makes lots of difference, try to have it off, in case you change the tempo just record new if you want to get best result.

minimal
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Post by minimal » Thu Apr 19, 2007 1:01 pm

4am wrote:ok i made some more testing:

with a "fresh and objective listening" i could spot a less important difference, so in part you are right (lucky i didn't bet big money on that) but it still lacks of deepth and it is really less defined.

now i suspect that it could depend on the fact that i tried to add some more swing (never enough for me) by letting the warp on....

i will try to disable everything and take the time to compare with the recordings made with soundforge...

anyone using hardware preamps to record electronic devices?
worth trying?
I use from time to time a pretty cheap tube preamp between analog synths and the mixing desk which is then routed to the rme, I get nice results considering the preamp is basic price stuff.

4am
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Post by 4am » Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:11 pm

rikhyray wrote:I already answered but somehow my message disappeared.
Did you check the routing, I remember there are FXed and no FXed options.It might be that , otherwise here my impressions about the box.

While I liked using it live I never used any of recorded MX, nothing about volume lvevels just it never sounded good enough, strange that in studio or on stage it was fine but somehow it didn't translate to "tape" that well
I used same rates and even same card as you do, keep all my MX material in archives but more as reference.
Except for some purely commercial, bread and butter productions- fitness music never used MX for serious stuff.
OK I am very picky about sound, what pleases me is Clavia G2, Evolver, Revolution,now even Reason 3,Korg Legacy( though this one I use sometimes) collect virtual dust since I got those bad boys and girls. However must admit that I liked the live sound of MX, why it does not translates so well in recording ? No idea but I can confirm your impressions.
glad to know i'm not the only one...
the mx simply sounds much better live than recorded
i will make some more tests, and control warping again...

4am
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Post by 4am » Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:15 pm

minimal wrote:
I use from time to time a pretty cheap tube preamp between analog synths and the mixing desk which is then routed to the rme, I get nice results considering the preamp is basic price stuff.
which one? can you lend it to me? :wink:

rikhyray
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Post by rikhyray » Thu Apr 19, 2007 4:34 pm

I used this one for pickup signal from Ovation, paid over 200 for it now it is a steal:
http://www.thomann.de/de/art_tube_mp.htm

minimal
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Post by minimal » Thu Apr 19, 2007 4:41 pm

4am wrote:
minimal wrote:
I use from time to time a pretty cheap tube preamp between analog synths and the mixing desk which is then routed to the rme, I get nice results considering the preamp is basic price stuff.
which one? can you lend it to me? :wink:
this one:
http://www.presonus.com/bluetubedp.html

bought just because I was in need of phantom power for a microphone, is a really cheap box but I found it to be funny for some recordings

you can have it if you need it
my studio is not far from your place :wink:

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