sampler ok? or buy kontakt 3.

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
Geezus
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Post by Geezus » Sun Aug 10, 2008 8:39 pm

Kontakt gives you multi point (beizer and step sequencer) envelopes and LFOs that you can freely assign to almost any parameter in your patch. Right there it blows away anything sampler can do. Not to mention the gazillion different filters, effects, and other goodies you can load into a patch. Sampler can't compete.

Grappadura
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Post by Grappadura » Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:13 pm

Poster wrote: The Abe slice function itself is very slick, but then starts the editing hassle..
Just slice by warp markers, then you´ll also see the chunks before.

Grappadura
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Post by Grappadura » Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:16 pm

Martyn wrote:
Landser wrote:Then you should look for Shortcircuit sampler. It has become freeware.
+1, good advice.

It's no longer being developed as the dev actually got hired by Ableton but it's an extremely capable tool, far, far better features than Sampler and a good interface too.

At least check it out before shelling out any cash just in case it's all you need.

http://vemberaudio.se/shortcircuit.php
Whats so much better about shortcircuit?

Machinesworking
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Post by Machinesworking » Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:37 pm

Nick the Zombie wrote: Bottom line: It depends on what you need, and what works for you. Just don't fall into the trap of thinking that more features means better.

Last night I got a great sound out of the Wretch Machine I bought, the thing will not replicate a sound, tubes just don't do exactly the same thing twice.
Recorded it, and threw it in Kontakt. The regular pitch algorithm that Sampler, and all old school samplers use is the default setting, sounded OK, but as the sound was a bass with a VERY noticeable oscillator buzz that would speed up and slow down across the keyboard, I decided to throw on the time and pitch algorithm. The difference to a single sample, (multiple samples wouldn't work in this case), was just out of this world. Now to do the same thing in Sampler you would have to literally take the audio file into Live, Warp it at different pitches, record that, and load 37+ audio files at different pitches across Sampler. What kills me is they have the algorithm, but they neglected to use it in Sampler, and don't hold your breath waiting for it to come in an update to Live. Basically this really simple, and straightforward reason as to why I was interested in Kontakt, and why Sampler fails sound design wise for any sample you want to retain the rhythmic or textural structure of across multiple keys.

I do Love Live, but the plug ins are annoying to me. I want to like them, but the the AAS versions are stripped down from the original plug ins, and the native code is far too rudimentary IMO. Sampler is about as good as the EXS24 in Logic, but it's not CPU light, which is just mind boggling to me, but I don't write code and have no idea why they couldn't make it lean? The fact that it shouldn't crash Live ever, and that it saves the instruments automatically in a Live set are great reasons to like it! but I just can't get behind any assertion that it's a better sound design tool, it simply isn't.
In the sense that you enjoy it more, of course I can't argue that. :)

Poster
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Post by Poster » Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:45 pm

Grappadura wrote:
Poster wrote: The Abe slice function itself is very slick, but then starts the editing hassle..
Just slice by warp markers, then you´ll also see the chunks before.
you didn't understand what I meant..

the hassle starts after the slicing..
setting parameters on all the Samplers and not being able to see all slices in one view..

I just prefer to have all my slices in 1 device, not multiples in a rack..
too bad Sampler doesn't do that..

Grappadura
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Post by Grappadura » Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:58 pm

Ok, I get it. True.

Martyn
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Post by Martyn » Sun Aug 10, 2008 11:13 pm

Grappadura wrote:
Whats so much better about shortcircuit?
33 filter types, assignable per note, x2 per patch. 3, 16 step lfo's (savable) with smoothing, two assignable envelopes and one envelope follower (again, per note) a comprehensive modulation matrix. Intuitive and clear velocity/zone editing window. And a similar feature set only this time global.

It's a great little sampler, all the more so now it's freeware.

Nick the Zombie
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Post by Nick the Zombie » Sun Aug 10, 2008 11:37 pm

Machinesworking wrote:
Nick the Zombie wrote: Bottom line: It depends on what you need, and what works for you. Just don't fall into the trap of thinking that more features means better.

Last night I got a great sound out of the Wretch Machine I bought, the thing will not replicate a sound, tubes just don't do exactly the same thing twice.
Recorded it, and threw it in Kontakt. The regular pitch algorithm that Sampler, and all old school samplers use is the default setting, sounded OK, but as the sound was a bass with a VERY noticeable oscillator buzz that would speed up and slow down across the keyboard, I decided to throw on the time and pitch algorithm. The difference to a single sample, (multiple samples wouldn't work in this case), was just out of this world. Now to do the same thing in Sampler you would have to literally take the audio file into Live, Warp it at different pitches, record that, and load 37+ audio files at different pitches across Sampler. What kills me is they have the algorithm, but they neglected to use it in Sampler, and don't hold your breath waiting for it to come in an update to Live. Basically this really simple, and straightforward reason as to why I was interested in Kontakt, and why Sampler fails sound design wise for any sample you want to retain the rhythmic or textural structure of across multiple keys.

I do Love Live, but the plug ins are annoying to me. I want to like them, but the the AAS versions are stripped down from the original plug ins, and the native code is far too rudimentary IMO. Sampler is about as good as the EXS24 in Logic, but it's not CPU light, which is just mind boggling to me, but I don't write code and have no idea why they couldn't make it lean? The fact that it shouldn't crash Live ever, and that it saves the instruments automatically in a Live set are great reasons to like it! but I just can't get behind any assertion that it's a better sound design tool, it simply isn't.
In the sense that you enjoy it more, of course I can't argue that. :)
Interesting, I'll have to give Kontakt another look. Might be good fodder for my next set of tutorial videos.

darrelldiaz
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Sampler FM..

Post by darrelldiaz » Sun Aug 10, 2008 11:47 pm

"what sold me on sampler was the FM ... which is really nice.

what i actually use, a bit more, (this will sound ridiculous) is "no interpolation" sample switch. there is some magic to the aliasing/grit/whatever that you get ... very cheap/digital sound that i think i am addicted to. it's a different sound from "Lo-Fi" effects. hard to explain, but certainly evocative of older samplers."

Me too!!!
MacBook Air 1.6GHz 2GB RAM, New iMac Core 2 Duo 2GHz, 4GB RAM, OSX 10.5.4, Live 7.0.9, Nord Stage 88, Korg Karma, Synclavier II & 3200, Waves SSL, etc.

Lazos
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Post by Lazos » Mon Aug 11, 2008 2:26 am

Poster wrote: I just prefer to have all my slices in 1 device, not multiples in a rack..
too bad Sampler doesn't do that..
But you can do that with Live's "slice to a single Sampler" preset," right?

Poster
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Post by Poster » Mon Aug 11, 2008 8:02 am

Lazos wrote:
Poster wrote: I just prefer to have all my slices in 1 device, not multiples in a rack..
too bad Sampler doesn't do that..
But you can do that with Live's "slice to a single Sampler" preset," right?
:? I swear I have never seen that slice preset before.. thanks..

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