how to use ableton live as a looper

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
mattianlaseppia
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how to use ableton live as a looper

Post by mattianlaseppia » Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:42 pm

in a live concert?

i've seen some kid beyond video, impressive! very impressive! but i don't understand how to.

so i'm asking for that and for what use as footswitch controller and how to configure it for using it as a looper.

thanks!

blank
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Post by blank » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:05 pm

check in the ableton videos

the tutorials and ect

it's all there m8
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Tone Deft
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Post by Tone Deft » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:11 pm

"Obsession is a great substitute for talent." - Steve Martin on learning the banjo

Dell Inspiron 15 7000, Live 10.1, Win10 Home, Edirol UA101, APC40, Remote SL, SPD-SX, mic, POD500HDX, JX305, Nova
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blank
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Post by blank » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:18 pm

There is no lesson about live looping ?

I'm pretty sure there is one no ?
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exaltron
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Post by exaltron » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:58 pm

Not sure if this is what you're trying to do, but AFAIK there is now way to take the tempo from the loop, ie, you have to start with a tempo and use the click from that tempo to create the loop. This is actually what I was told by Ableton support.

I'm hoping they could come up with a way to do this in the future as it seems very basic: unquantized loop-start and loop-end, then take the tempo from that (assuming number of bars and rhythm defined by user). I remember basic looping pedals like boomerang could do this way back in the 90s.
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threestringclarinet
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Post by threestringclarinet » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:59 pm

This one helped me the most.

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

Cheers
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hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Wed Jan 02, 2008 6:12 pm

exaltron wrote:Not sure if this is what you're trying to do, but AFAIK there is now way to take the tempo from the loop, ie, you have to start with a tempo and use the click from that tempo to create the loop. This is actually what I was told by Ableton support.

I'm hoping they could come up with a way to do this in the future as it seems very basic: unquantized loop-start and loop-end, then take the tempo from that (assuming number of bars and rhythm defined by user). I remember basic looping pedals like boomerang could do this way back in the 90s.
If only it were that easy...
Live still starts at a tempo, that alone messes the whole one loop thing. Because if you change tempo after recording a bar, you don't end up with a bar.
I've been looking into this for a while because i work with a looper and this is his number one wish. But its not at easy as it seems.
Only something externally will enable this to work with Live. When you get to that point in your research, you'll start wondering why you're not taking your findings to build a standalone looper.

What Would Angstrom Do? :D

exaltron
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Post by exaltron » Wed Jan 02, 2008 7:10 pm

hoffman2k wrote: If only it were that easy...
Live still starts at a tempo, that alone messes the whole one loop thing. Because if you change tempo after recording a bar, you don't end up with a bar.
I've been looking into this for a while because i work with a looper and this is his number one wish. But its not at easy as it seems.
Only something externally will enable this to work with Live. When you get to that point in your research, you'll start wondering why you're not taking your findings to build a standalone looper.

What Would Angstrom Do? :D
No doubt, I just don't understand why they couldn't just create a mode where Live would send the loop length to the same place the tap-tempo data goes. You could start with some generic tempo, then change to the new tempo when the tempo-defining loop is ended.

I'm surprised that artists like Kid Beyond haven't persuaded Abes to add this feature. I mean come on, one of the coolest (if not THE coolest) aspect of Live is that you can create compositions in a live setting out of thin air. Having to start with a click track just takes so much spontaneity out of that proposition. Sort of like wearing a raincoat in the shower (to borrow a metaphor).

The only workaround I did figure out with the foot pedal is to start playing while Live is stopped on zero, then tap 1-2-3 on the tap tempo (skip the four as it won't generally improve the tempo capture) and then start a loop on the next 1. I've had about a 53% success rate with this method, ie, FAIL.
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ejectorset
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Post by ejectorset » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:31 pm

what are you guys going on and on about. for a long time (at least since v4) live has been able to easily midi map the tap tempo button on the gui.

if you have a footcontroller (like kid beyond) all you gotta do is map out the tap tempo to one of the buttons. then when you start a new song out of thin air tap along for the first bar of whatever you play.

then play 1 more bar that you actually record. then loop on top of that.

also remember you can have your own click track going to your monitors/headphones (that doesn't get sent to the main PA) so that you can play your first loop at whatever tempo you have previously determined for each "song"/idea that you build/loop/improv/create live.
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exaltron
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Post by exaltron » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:47 pm

ejectorset wrote:what are you guys going on and on about. for a long time (at least since v4) live has been able to easily midi map the tap tempo button on the gui.

if you have a footcontroller (like kid beyond) all you gotta do is map out the tap tempo to one of the buttons. then when you start a new song out of thin air tap along for the first bar of whatever you play.

then play 1 more bar that you actually record. then loop on top of that.

also remember you can have your own click track going to your monitors/headphones (that doesn't get sent to the main PA) so that you can play your first loop at whatever tempo you have previously determined for each "song"/idea that you build/loop/improv/create live.
As I said, that's exactly what I'm doing- mapping to a foot pedal and tapping out the tempo. But by no means is that as easy as just having the tempo be defined by the length of the loop that you play. Try playing a syncopated trumpet line or singing while tapping out 1-2-3. Not easy, hence my very low success rate. I realize with practice this might get better, but the point of Live is to make things as easy as possible so that you can make music.
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TroyP
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Post by TroyP » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:55 pm

It does get easier. At least it has for me. I'm starting loops mid-way through songs, so am having to learn to tap and fire at the right times. I'm lead singer and also play some percussion (but am a beginner at that).

At first, there were lots of train wrecks during rehearsal. Fortunately, the band didn't just shoot me. :) Now (about 4 months later) it's getting easier.

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Post by Tone Deft » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:55 pm

thing is most musicians can play to a metronome, some can't. :P <-- that's a joke exaltron.


this is so like the time signature debate. most people could do time sig changes for many years, a few users felt it stopped them from using Live and they ranted wildly. due to them we got a new feature, hooray. I would like this feature but I loop without it.

exaltron is to looping what stale bread is to the slicer.
(that was an SAT question)

that reminds me, how about some OSC in this mother. I could fix this issue,I think.
- read the loop length from Live
- write this loop length back into Live and set the tempo
it'd be a max patch that the user wouldn't even have to see or touch.
"Obsession is a great substitute for talent." - Steve Martin on learning the banjo

Dell Inspiron 15 7000, Live 10.1, Win10 Home, Edirol UA101, APC40, Remote SL, SPD-SX, mic, POD500HDX, JX305, Nova
soundcloud.com/tone-deft

hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:57 pm

Tone Deft wrote:thing is most musicians can play to a metronome, some can't. :P <-- that's a joke exaltron.


this is so like the time signature debate. most people could do time sig changes for many years, a few users felt it stopped them from using Live and they ranted wildly. due to them we got a new feature, hooray. I would like this feature but I loop without it.

exaltron is to looping what stale bread is to the slicer.
(that was an SAT question)
Good idea. We need to make Stale Bread realize the power of OSC. Only he has the power...

exaltron
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Post by exaltron » Wed Jan 02, 2008 10:09 pm

Tone Deft wrote:thing is most musicians can play to a metronome, some can't. :P <-- that's a joke exaltron.


this is so like the time signature debate. most people could do time sig changes for many years, a few users felt it stopped them from using Live and they ranted wildly. due to them we got a new feature, hooray. I would like this feature but I loop without it.

exaltron is to looping what stale bread is to the slicer.
(that was an SAT question)

that reminds me, how about some OSC in this mother. I could fix this issue,I think.
- read the loop length from Live
- write this loop length back into Live and set the tempo
it'd be a max patch that the user wouldn't even have to see or touch.
Cheap shot, but what else should one expect on this board :P

It's actually not so much a question of rhythm to my mind, but coordination (ie, to play something that's not straight quarter notes while tapping straight quarter notes). It's like saying put Herbie Hancock behind a drum kit and tell him to play a James Brown beat. Not g'a happen.

I scored very well on the SATs, but I don't get the analogy. I make loops lose their edge?
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exaltron
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Post by exaltron » Wed Jan 02, 2008 10:15 pm

TroyP wrote:It does get easier. At least it has for me. I'm starting loops mid-way through songs, so am having to learn to tap and fire at the right times. I'm lead singer and also play some percussion (but am a beginner at that).

At first, there were lots of train wrecks during rehearsal. Fortunately, the band didn't just shoot me. :) Now (about 4 months later) it's getting easier.
See this is my whole point- the standalone loop modules like boomerang and Jam Man never took anyone four months of practice to get spontaneous tempos happening. I'm curious, what would you say your confidence level is right now when you go on stage as far as getting all your loops going smoothly?
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