thinks : is a good faker equivalent to a good performer?

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
beats me
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Post by beats me » Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:25 am

Poster wrote:
b0unce wrote:I just straight up don't like being lied to.
If there's nothing wrong with pretending to perform music live, then why not advertise it as such.

TONIGHT AT MELKWEG PRETENDING TO PLAY MUSIC LIVE: CHRIS CLARK
DON'T MISS IT
TICKETS e16.50 AT THE DOOR
spot on..
Oh! How about the name DJ Prerecorded? Nobody use that. It's mine now.

nathannn
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Post by nathannn » Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:28 am

here is what i notice when i go out..
the girls.. nothing more.
i could give a shit who is doing what with what software.
i am there thinking one thing and im not using my brain to think with either.
The Push / Novation Launch Pad / Novation Launch Pad Pro / Novation Launch Key
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kabuki
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Post by kabuki » Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:41 am

Easy: young pretty girls love rap.

The only request I got all night was from a cougar wanting to hear some ACDC (which I prepped), but couldn't play for obvious reasons.

Not to say there were a few of the songs I chose which didn't completely kill... They weren't into the Justice mashup and "Control" bu Little Sister, but they needed a breather. So it worked out.

The bride and groom have decent taste in Music and picked the song list. I edited it a bit to avoid problems, like REALLY bad songs (Ja Rule), but for the most part, it wasn't a hard croud to please. It's not like I was playing to a crowd of IDM assholes and indie nerds that were trying to trainspot me oout of the room.

The bar wasn't too high.
15" PB 2.5 Ghz, 4 Gig RAM, 750 GB HD, Live 9 still no cue points or program change messages?!?. Doesn't do shit.

kabuki
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Post by kabuki » Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:44 am

I guess the answer to the original question is this:

It depends on who's at the gig: people there who enjoy the music, or people there who enjoy watching the performer fuck up.
15" PB 2.5 Ghz, 4 Gig RAM, 750 GB HD, Live 9 still no cue points or program change messages?!?. Doesn't do shit.

Nogi
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Post by Nogi » Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:44 am

It doesn't matter how believable the fake is, it will fail to convince some. Interestingly, a genuine performer will produce the same effect. Many people are not moved by reality.

Lazos
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Post by Lazos » Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:50 am

beats me wrote:
kabuki wrote:It must be noted that the stuff COSM does blows my mind. That guy really does preform magic.
COSM is amazing but there's a problem right there. You can't hold everybody up to that standard. Electronica composers are held up to a higher standard than traditional musicians in some cases and I'm not exactly sure why. You could go to a rock show and the guitarist could play the 4 easiest chords ever invneted the entire show or ride the muted downtuned E string and people would go nuts and come out saying it was an amazing show. My grandmother could play Nirvana songs.

But stick a guy in front of a computer with a couple controllers and you expect him to flawlessly perform the work of an entire band live, which by the way was actaully performed by a computer, and at the same time look like the rock star guitarist who is mostly just posing.
I agree, to a certain extent. However, I'll ask everyone this: WHO holds electronica composers to a higher standard than the traditional musicians? Perhaps mostly other electronica composer/musicians? If what you are saying is true, kabuki (And I don't doubt it that overall, most people don't care if the electronic "performance" that they are experiencing is just someone pressing "play,") then why worry about it at all?

I think we also have to separate the idea for someone "faking it" and someone having or not having good stage presence and the ability to connect with the audience. Two separate issues in a way . . .

As far as my current working methods, I sit somewhere in the middle by being a solo performer and having some stuff very worked out and other stuff created in the moment. The extreme of being a solo performer and making everything from a blank set has not really worked for me (it might if Live were to implement proper looping capabilities :evil: :wink: but I digress . . .)

beats me
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Post by beats me » Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:54 am

kabuki wrote:Easy: young pretty girls love rap.

The only request I got all night was from a cougar wanting to hear some ACDC (which I prepped), but couldn't play for obvious reasons.

Not to say there were a few of the songs I chose which didn't completely kill... They weren't into the Justice mashup and "Control" bu Little Sister, but they needed a breather. So it worked out.

The bride and groom have decent taste in Music and picked the song list. I edited it a bit to avoid problems, like REALLY bad songs (Ja Rule), but for the most part, it wasn't a hard croud to please. It's not like I was playing to a crowd of IDM assholes and indie nerds that were trying to trainspot me oout of the room.

The bar wasn't too high.
I'm not really a big fan of (new) Hip Hop but I did notice it was kind of fun when I spun it at my friend's wedding and instead of the traditional 10 o'clock cutoff time we pretty much closed it down like it was a full club night. I also got a lot of complements from the drunk young ladies for pretty much doing jack squat as far as DJing.

Still couldn't avoid the random requests though and the adult cry babies who were upset that I chose keeping the dance floor packed over playing the funky chicken.

kabuki
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Post by kabuki » Sat Feb 02, 2008 1:49 am

beats me wrote:
kabuki wrote:Easy: young pretty girls love rap.

The only request I got all night was from a cougar wanting to hear some ACDC (which I prepped), but couldn't play for obvious reasons.

Not to say there were a few of the songs I chose which didn't completely kill... They weren't into the Justice mashup and "Control" bu Little Sister, but they needed a breather. So it worked out.

The bride and groom have decent taste in Music and picked the song list. I edited it a bit to avoid problems, like REALLY bad songs (Ja Rule), but for the most part, it wasn't a hard croud to please. It's not like I was playing to a crowd of IDM assholes and indie nerds that were trying to trainspot me oout of the room.

The bar wasn't too high.
I'm not really a big fan of (new) Hip Hop but I did notice it was kind of fun when I spun it at my friend's wedding and instead of the traditional 10 o'clock cutoff time we pretty much closed it down like it was a full club night. I also got a lot of complements from the drunk young ladies for pretty much doing jack squat as far as DJing.

Still couldn't avoid the random requests though and the adult cry babies who were upset that I chose keeping the dance floor packed over playing the funky chicken.
I played new and old stuff. They dug it all. Of course, the newer stuff was easier for them to sing along with, but it all worked. I played some Journey, Neil Diamond and John Cougar to open (to get the old ladies and frat girls hyped. It worked flawlessly). I had to skip my set of new/old disco due to a slow start by the coordinator. Oh well. The world has heard enough Grease.
15" PB 2.5 Ghz, 4 Gig RAM, 750 GB HD, Live 9 still no cue points or program change messages?!?. Doesn't do shit.

Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Sat Feb 02, 2008 2:01 am

kabuki wrote:I played some Journey, Neil Diamond and John Cougar to open
I'm glad to see you don't need 20 years of Buddhist meditation to get rid of your ego ...

just a single wedding gig will do it.

:wink:

Tone Deft
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Post by Tone Deft » Sat Feb 02, 2008 2:10 am

fake titties
fake orgasms
fake love
fake sugar
fake butter

are all fine and good for people who want to settle but once you've had the REAL deal you can tell the difference, and it's those things that make life that much sweeter.
"Obsession is a great substitute for talent." - Steve Martin on learning the banjo

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Lazos
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Post by Lazos » Sat Feb 02, 2008 2:52 am

Yup, yup.

nathannn
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Post by nathannn » Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:03 am

Tone Deft wrote:fake titties
fake orgasms
fake love
fake sugar
fake butter

are all fine and good for people who want to settle but once you've had the REAL deal you can tell the difference, and it's those things that make life that much sweeter.
damn
that would be a great lyric
The Push / Novation Launch Pad / Novation Launch Pad Pro / Novation Launch Key
/ Launch Control XL / Machine MkII / Machine Studio / BeatStep / Livid OhmRGB / Livid Code V2 / Apc 40 MKII

no computers or synths

20 Copies of Ableton Live Lite.

3dot...
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Post by 3dot... » Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:08 am

Image


...yep

just about the same...
Image

the ar
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Post by the ar » Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:10 am

I have to say that I'd honestly go with a LESS improvised set if that would allow me to interact more with the crowd and stop me from looking like a goofbag hunched over his laptop BUT I would never, NEVER mime to a cd with a pre-recorded set.
Why?
Because it wouldn't be fun.
In medio stat virtus (that's 'Virtue stands in the middle' for all of you who despise latin :D)

stonee
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Post by stonee » Sat Feb 02, 2008 3:19 am

this is the biggest thing that is stopping me from playing live. I have my songs, and people enjoy them, but what do I do when I'm playing them?

most of my new sets are getting me more interactive.

I suppose i could always add lyrics as well...

I'm starting to realize now that its not how many nobs a dj can turn on stage that makes the performance. the key to being a good dj is personality and the interaction.




in the end, its whatever pleases the crowd is the ultimate.

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