DJing with Live

Discussion of music production, audio, equipment and any related topics, either with or without Ableton Live
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SWAN808
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DJing with Live

Post by SWAN808 » Sat Aug 09, 2008 4:32 pm

I know this has probably been beaten to death a million times - but Im new and gonna risk asking/discussing it.....

Having started DJed on Sl1200s for maybe 9 years I started using Ableton instead - mainly because I was tired of buying tons of records but only playing out few of them as once Id got home I either didnt like them that much or they didnt fit into my sets or style of music in the end..... Also the production may be rubbish etc - so it would be £7 lost......However using digital meant I could get so much more for my money, and I could mess with it in new and awesome ways!

However this honeymoon period is subsiding.....I have stood against the tide at my clubnight where the other 4 DJs stick with vinyl -then theres me with my Macbook, Novation SL25 and RME Fireface to set -up....

I realise whilst I do edit many tracks in a mix - its not essential....and I rarely use the creative potential when putting a set together I planned....

But thats not the biggest bug-bear - I have a thorn in my side relating to sound quality vs the decks. Last night after I played my set I noticed my mate came on after me with a slab of deep techy house - and it really punched and thumped on the system - in a way that it didnt seem mine were.....Averagely mixed digital tracks sound thin with harsh treble.....Although Ive noticed the well mixed digital tracks can sound punchy and clear......

On the other hand badly mixed 12" dont sound great either - I do remember often not being satisfied with records I had bought.....but you dont get that harsh treble with records.....?

SO what do people think of the sound quality of Ableton vs Decks and vs other DJ software such as Traktor? Im kind of looking to get some others views to see if my feelings on this are similar to others or Im obsessing about very little real difference....

Peace

Tone Deft
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Post by Tone Deft » Sat Aug 09, 2008 7:38 pm

depends on how you encode the tracks. there's a million things that the user can do wrong before you can blame Live on sound quality.

going from one application to another to get better sound quality won't matter, the differences are incredibly minute, pretty much negligible, you'd have to compare your sound card to the DJ's mixer first. but it doesn't matter when comparing raw audio (vinyl) to compressed audio files which can have obvious HUGE differences.
"Obsession is a great substitute for talent." - Steve Martin on learning the banjo

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rikhyray
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Post by rikhyray » Sat Aug 09, 2008 10:58 pm

Some people might say CD-16/44.1 is fine, or even mp3 at 320 or whatever.but that is not even worth discussing.
Of course you can get away with anything but to keep up to vinyl the minimum would be no less then 24/44.1. and if some say that is not enough I wouldn't argue. 24/44.1 is still reasonable for a file size and sounds fine even on huge systems.

leisuremuffin
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Post by leisuremuffin » Sat Aug 09, 2008 11:14 pm

that's just silly.


first of all, a record has a possible dynamic range of 75db. 16bit digital has 96db.



there is no reason in the world that a 16bit/44.1 pcm file can't have the same impact as the identical recording as a record.


.lm.
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Pepehouse
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Post by Pepehouse » Sun Aug 10, 2008 12:00 am

Set a maximizer on your master channel.
A day without House Music isn't the end of the world but is so damn close.

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brom
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Post by brom » Sun Aug 10, 2008 2:00 am

If you buy your digital tracks as .wav then it should sound better then vinyl, as it should be the file which was used to cut the vinyl in the first place. I know .wav is a big file, but todays hard drives are more than adequate to handle this sort of thing.

I personally use mp3 for financial reasons. I try to stay at 320kbs, but I have dropped tracks as low as 192kbs with out anyone noticing. Saying this, I haven't had a chance to play on a large soundsystem.

The software that is used to encode the mp3 can also effect sound quality.
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This all started when I went to make a mixtape for my crush...

clipless
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Post by clipless » Sun Aug 10, 2008 2:41 am

Mp3 sound like crap because they are mastered WRONG.
vynils don't suffer from this problem because in them the music has to be open and uncompressed to avoid the needle to jump out of the groove.
today's records on Mp3 are mastered to sound loud not to sound good.

It's the encoding? NO, IT IS NOT!!!

I remember going to a DJ gig of a friend of mine who was playin french electro in mp3. there was power in the sound system and I thought it was good sound, then another friend came on to the booth and played some really old 80 records in mp3. and THAT WAS GOOD SOUND. I was speechless, 80's music mastered 20 years ago sounded so Clear and punchy compared to digitally-mastered-21st-century-dance-floor-hit!!!

Sound quality in our days is not priority. and THAT HAS TO CHANGE!

When that happens mp3-based DJ gigs will sound better, clear, powerful and emotion filled, like in the old days
Last edited by clipless on Sun Aug 10, 2008 5:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

Tone Deft
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Post by Tone Deft » Sun Aug 10, 2008 4:31 am

/grabs popcorn.
"Obsession is a great substitute for talent." - Steve Martin on learning the banjo

Dell Inspiron 15 7000, Live 10.1, Win10 Home, Edirol UA101, APC40, Remote SL, SPD-SX, mic, guitars, JX305, Nova
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SWAN808
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Post by SWAN808 » Sun Aug 10, 2008 10:49 pm

brom wrote:If you buy your digital tracks as .wav then it should sound better then vinyl, as it should be the file which was used to cut the vinyl in the first place.
It was my understanding that that vinyl master was a different process (specific to the requirements of vinyl pressing) to a .wav master? Or do labels just use the same master for both? Vinyl needs special conditions in the mastering which gives its sound.

eg
Hi Cut filter
Low Cut filter <30
compression etc
Mono bass frequencies

etc etc

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