Whats the official point of view about the 128 issue ?

dom · Post by **dom** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 6:49 pm

hey rob,

you might want to read the first page of the thread in order to learn why your post is totally redundant.

;-)

Cheers,
Dom

Lo-Fi Massahkah · Post by **Lo-Fi Massahkah** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 7:12 pm

robleighton22 wrote:the only thing i hate or just dont understand is why there is not a way of choosing which parameters end up in the 128 list of usable parameters. [...] if there was a way u could change the way in which the order of parameters would appear

...and if you read the thread - Dom stated that the functionality you're describing is very likely to be implemented in future versions.

.m

headquest · Post by **headquest** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:38 pm

Dom, thanks for the clarification...

dom wrote: If it would be easy we would add it for sure, you all know that we're among the companies taking user input as serious as possible

I do know that yes, and my experience of ABleton is you are very good at listening to users, hence my surpise in this case, ... but also my optomism

but actually in this case it is so hard to do that the cost-benefit ratio is just unreal.

So it is possible, but maybe expensive (costed?)... sorry, confused by that point.

What i would like to illustrate is that it makes us happy to fulfill user wishes and if in some cases it does not happen as fast as you wish for or even at all the reason is not that we're having fun denying them.

Cheers,
Dom

cool.

Geezus · Post by **Geezus** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:57 pm

dom wrote:
Tweaking Knobs wrote:I just want to know if the guys at ableton has said something about this.
Hey TK,

Statement so far: Most likely Live will never support more than 128 automated parameters for one plugin at the same time but in a future version you will for sure be able to select from all parameters a plugin offers - not only the first 128 as this is obviously pretty limiting in a lot of cases.

Cheers,
Dom

thank fucking christ. here's my hope against hopes on this front:

1. I hope this is part of v. 8. I cant wait any longer than that
2. I hope this doesnt mean that I have to use some sort of utility to re-arrange the order of parameters on all my plugins so that all the ones I want to use become the first 128. That would NOT be cool. Just disable automation or give an error message if I try to do something with more than 128 parameters at a time, please dont do it by setting a limit on how many parameters Live can list or see. I dont want to spend all my time doing parameter housecleaning when I could be making music instead.
If you do a search in the feature request forum I made a post that outlines a really good way to do this without taking over the GUI. Trick is basically to list them in a self contained scroll box like drum racks, only with a "search" function, or a jump to last tweaked parameter function, and numerical page select box for plugins that have so many parameters that using scroll bar would be cumbersome due to resolution issues.

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Thu Oct 09, 2008 12:41 am

dom wrote:
What i would like to illustrate is that it makes us happy to fulfill user wishes and if in some cases it does not happen as fast as you wish for or even at all the reason is not that we're having fun denying them.

Understood, my problem is more about using Live live. I was lucky enough to trade some gear for a Poly Evolver, and it's upsetting to read about beat clock being basically broken in Live. I understand the 128 parameter limit, it just makes sense that a limitation like that isn't done out of any malice, and I mean no malice at all when I say that a feature that is supposed to work that doesn't is far more upsetting to me than a known limitation. I hope the sync issue is fixed in a non paid update, but apparently Live hasn't synced well to outboard hardware for a few versions.

I know it's "not the right thread" etc. but it goes back to my feeling that features Live already is supposed to have are more important to get right than fixing obvious shortcomings in the unique engine that Live is based on!

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Thu Oct 09, 2008 5:07 am

A shameless bump on this Dom. Sorry to seem to single you out, but it would be nice if there was a reply for yet another thread about the drift that Live has when synced via MIDI Clock to anything, hardware, software, another laptop with Live on it....

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... sc&start=0

people are reporting serious drift with all of it.
If it's again due to the unique audio engine in Live etc. that would be a good enough reply, but no reply at all is frustrating. Enough for me to look like an ass highjacking another thread for the slim possibility that we get an answer.

dom · Post by **dom** » Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:00 am

Hey Machines,

there's nothing like a single general problem with midi sync, a lot of folks have rock solid midi clock timing even between to laptops.
No doubt, there seem to be multiple problems regarding different setups and we're happy to go after those, but discussing it here does not help, in order to do something we need detailed bug reports to reproduce those problems.

First, please read the Midi fact sheet you can find in your manual. Then take a look here for the details we need:
http://www.ableton.com/pages/support_contact

Also include what kind of midi hardware is used, how you set it all up and what exactly you're doing.

Cheers,
Dom

Baron von Case · Post by **Baron von Case** » Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:23 am

You guys honestly need 128? Or is it that you've come somewhat close and freaked out that it might not meet your needs someday?

forge · Post by **forge** » Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:30 am

Baron von Case wrote:You guys honestly need 128? Or is it that you've come somewhat close and freaked out that it might not meet your needs someday?

it's not that - it's about accessing those that might be outside the 1st 128

Tweaking Knobs · Post by **Tweaking Knobs** » Thu Oct 09, 2008 11:31 am

Baron von Case wrote:You guys honestly need 128? Or is it that you've come somewhat close and freaked out that it might not meet your needs someday?

you dont get it, even if i just want to automate one single parameter , if its number is the 129 i just cant automate.

got it now ?

sowhoso · Post by **sowhoso** » Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:50 am

dom wrote:
Tweaking Knobs wrote:I just want to know if the guys at ableton has said something about this.
Hey TK,

Statement so far: Most likely Live will never support more than 128 automated parameters for one plugin at the same time but in a future version you will for sure be able to select from all parameters a plugin offers - not only the first 128 as this is obviously pretty limiting in a lot of cases.

Cheers,
Dom

hopefully it's a 7.xx update and not something we have to pay extra for. It should have been there already

ava · Post by **ava** » Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:53 am

128 parameters is the official standard for vst's, and anyway if you can't make a decent synth with only 128 parameters then theres something wrong with it...

Were trying to make music and not fly a space shuttle...

robleighton22 · Post by **robleighton22** » Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:07 am

dom wrote:hey rob,

you might want to read the first page of the thread in order to learn why your post is totally redundant.

Cheers,
Dom

whoops. i clearly need to learn to read. good stuff. hehe..

Mike Goodwin · Post by **Mike Goodwin** » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:18 am

dom wrote:
Tweaking Knobs wrote:I just want to know if the guys at ableton has said something about this.
Hey TK,

Statement so far: Most likely Live will never support more than 128 automated parameters for one plugin at the same time but in a future version you will for sure be able to select from all parameters a plugin offers - not only the first 128 as this is obviously pretty limiting in a lot of cases.

Cheers,
Dom

That is good news. I just use kore2 now but it will be good for others and for when I don't want to use Kore.

stutter · Post by **stutter** » Fri Oct 10, 2008 11:23 am

the vespa analogy made me laugh.

Dom: would this 128 re-ordering be achieved by vstxml support by any chance?

Whats the official point of view about the 128 issue ?

Re: Whats the official point of view about the 128 issue ?

Re: Whats the official point of view about the 128 issue ?

Re: Whats the official point of view about the 128 issue ?