ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

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SKAGGS
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ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by SKAGGS » Fri Feb 18, 2011 7:41 am

Hello!

Here are the issues I'm having, Any advice or help would be greatly appreciated!!

1. While manipulating volume automation or changing the loop range brackets in arrangement view only (ie: 2 bars vs 4 etc.) The program gets VERY clunky in it's graphics. Meaning, I try to move an automation elbow joint to the left and my mouse freezes- a second later the joint is where I moved the mouse to, but NO animation represented the motion. It just hangs up then the screen jumps to the new position etc..

2. The system will do these three things randomly:
(1) A random track within a session will suddenly sound as though it's running at 8bits (the daft punk-ish type sound -unintentional haha) then it will sort of correct it's self slowly -- basically a simple clocking type error

(2) When Recording into the system via the Analog Line inputs with 1/4 cables etc.. certain takes will sounds as though they have CRAZY clocking errors going throughout the recording. Other takes are completely fine.

(3) After, what seems to be a random amount of time, the system will be just kicking ass - then inexplicably stop all audio. Pressing space bar or clicking around the DAW won't do a thing. However the DAW is NOT frozen. Opening the preferences pain and toggling the sample rate from 48 to 44 back to 48 fixes the problem.
(yes I'm running 48kHz - maybe that could be a factor?)

**I have no outboard Digital gear that requires word clock or any other type of word sync so the Profire is clocking internally. I had no problems with this interface before I upgraded my computer (was on an INTEL iMac 2007 to 2011)

I had the idea of downgrading to OS X 10.6.3 (I have the retail copy of that), but the "genius" at the apple store suggested that my video card may not support the older OS or the other way around.. -> thoughts?

Thanks in advance -

*Here's the Hardware / Software:

-CPU-
MacPro: 5.1
Quad-Core Intel Xeon - 2.8GHz
3Gigs of Ram
x2 internal (1 TB Drives) -> one for System, one for Audio (Western Digital, 72RPM, 32MB Buffer, 3Gbps x-fer Speed)
27" Apple Cinema Display (only mentioned because other forums suggest the large screen could cause problems in Ableton)
____________
-Sound Interface-
M-Audio ProFire 2626
_____________
-Software-
(I'll spare ALL of it, to just get to the problem)
Ableton Live 8
MAC OS X 10.6.6
Last edited by SKAGGS on Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.
• Mac Pro (5.1) Xeon Quad-Core 2.8GHz | 8 GB RAM | 2x 1TB HD | 10.6.8
• Live Suite 9.0.4
• ProFire 2626
• Moog Little Phatty SE-II - Arturia MiniBrute - Roland JX-3P (w/PG-200) - Nord Electro 2 "Sixty one" - Roland GAIA SH-01

jasinski
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by jasinski » Sat Feb 19, 2011 7:45 pm

That definitely sounds like a hardware problem. How long is it going to be in the apple store for repairs?
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MacPro / MacBookPro / Live 8
My art and music

SKAGGS
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by SKAGGS » Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:49 pm

I just got the machine back this morning, all they did was test the software and hardware, and it "passed" (what ever that means)

when I took the system back to my studio and tested the current session I was having all the problems with, using my internal built in APPLE sound card.. I've discovered that using that built in sound hardware on the Mac Pro - causes NO PROBLEMS. I can only assume that there is a complication with the M-Audio hardware/software in conjunction with Ableton and OS X 10.6.6


Additionally I found that my FIRM WARE version on the Profire was: 1.0.10 There has to be at LEAST a 2.0.0 version somewhere. I'll start digging.


Thanks for the reply!!
• Mac Pro (5.1) Xeon Quad-Core 2.8GHz | 8 GB RAM | 2x 1TB HD | 10.6.8
• Live Suite 9.0.4
• ProFire 2626
• Moog Little Phatty SE-II - Arturia MiniBrute - Roland JX-3P (w/PG-200) - Nord Electro 2 "Sixty one" - Roland GAIA SH-01

Boss Level Music
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by Boss Level Music » Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:50 am

Out of curiousity, is the sample rate set the same in Both Live and the Profire?

I use the same interface and have had no problems, even with all inputs active, but I'm on PC so...

SKAGGS
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by SKAGGS » Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:14 pm

Hi "Boss Level Music"! -- Thanks for the response!

I triple checked the sample rate, they were the same.. Also when I manipulate the sample rate in the Ableton prefs, it automatically changes it in the Profire manager, so yeah unfortunately those two matched. Good call though.. Since you've posted, I've discovered another thing.. I just went the entire morning without a crash, and I had my sample rate set to 44.1kHz - I think there may be an issue with the 48kHz.. However, it wasn't perfect, it still had a couple of glitchy things going when I would duplicate a piece of audio, or fiddle around with the automation.. So there's still an issue, but it looks like I'm chipping away the fat to the core.. I honestly think that Ableton needs to address OS X 10.6.6 with a little TLC. Both Ableton's and M-Audio's sites say that the current drivers have been "Approved" to work with 10.6.6 - but they were designed for 10.6.3(4)-ish. There's just something squishy in 10.6.6 that needs to be ironed out.

Yeah, the fact that your on a PC might be the difference in success levels regarding the interface. My stupid OS changes every week haha! So yours is most likely playing well with your version of Windows. (btw - I don't hate, or ridicule - It's about the music, and art - who cares what you're using to make it- plus I have a soft spot in my heart for the old ATX days when I could build my own computer- stupid Macs haha! :) ..)


Hopefully This will all get worked out.. or I'll just get used to the way it works.. ugh. computers.
• Mac Pro (5.1) Xeon Quad-Core 2.8GHz | 8 GB RAM | 2x 1TB HD | 10.6.8
• Live Suite 9.0.4
• ProFire 2626
• Moog Little Phatty SE-II - Arturia MiniBrute - Roland JX-3P (w/PG-200) - Nord Electro 2 "Sixty one" - Roland GAIA SH-01

SKAGGS
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by SKAGGS » Mon Feb 21, 2011 7:22 pm

"I just went the entire morning without a crash, and I had my sample rate set to 44.1kHz - "

Scratch that, it bugged out the next time i tried using it.. So the sample rate (no matter the setting) is/isn't the problem.. not sure..
• Mac Pro (5.1) Xeon Quad-Core 2.8GHz | 8 GB RAM | 2x 1TB HD | 10.6.8
• Live Suite 9.0.4
• ProFire 2626
• Moog Little Phatty SE-II - Arturia MiniBrute - Roland JX-3P (w/PG-200) - Nord Electro 2 "Sixty one" - Roland GAIA SH-01

Boss Level Music
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by Boss Level Music » Mon Feb 21, 2011 8:23 pm

A couple more ideas, don't know if they will help at all.

Have you tried a different FW cable? I've had strange issues with a bad USB cable on an old interface. Worth a shot if you have one lying around.

Possibly a conflict with onboard audio or video. Is the onboard audio disabled? Maybe changing video setting will help if you suspect the large display to be a factor

steko
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by steko » Mon Feb 21, 2011 11:56 pm

Hi SKAGGS!
I had the idea of downgrading to OS X 10.6.3 (I have the retail copy of that), but the "genus" at the apple store suggested that my video card may not support the older OS or the other way around.. -> thoughts?
Afaik Mac Pro 5,1 came with a special build of 10.6.4, so you shouldn't downgrade to 10.6.3: http://support.apple.com/kb/HT2186 - http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1159

You can always reinstall Snow Leopard over your existing installation with the DVD, that came with your Mac & then install the 10.6.5 Combo & then run Software Update - only the system stuff will be overwritten, your other stuff stays in place. Nevertheless be sure you have an actual backup before doing that!

I dunno - M-Audio's OS X driver update policy, at least in the past, often was quiet bad. Maybe that changed. Seems like the 10.6.6 drivers are out for a while...

As mentioned try another fw cable. Try another fw-port. Also try uninstalling the 2626 stuff with the uninstaller that comes with the ProFireSeries_OSX_2_3_1.dmg.

Did you repair permissions in Disc Utility (Applications/Utilities)?

To me looks like a M-Audio OS X thing (or a M-Audio OS X Ableton thing)…
Rahad Jackson wrote:My Awesome Mix Tape #6

steko
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by steko » Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:23 am

First try this: http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php? ... 2#p1252332 (instead of deleting, just drag "Preferences.cfg" & "Template.als" to your desktop after you have quit Live.

If that doesn't solve it, you don't have to recreate...
Rahad Jackson wrote:My Awesome Mix Tape #6

SKAGGS
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by SKAGGS » Tue Feb 22, 2011 10:35 pm

Steko,

Somehow I knew you'd be the shit here! hahaha! Nice one man!! I'll give those things a go, and see what happens! I definitely have backups, and the beauty of my secondary HD is all my music session files, audio files, and the rest of it are intact (even if I somehow accidentally wiped my System HD) :D

Yeah, I started to surmise that it was an Ableton vs OS X vs M-Audio thing. Now I'm thinking it's more an OS x VS M-Audio thing.

However, Ableton has been in contact with me on this and they've sent me a new beta version. So I'm going to give that one a go- and if that fails - I'll pop over to your suggestions..

Honestly, the issues I"m having with this system are obvious communication errors between the OS, The software, and M-Audio's thing, but all of it is overshadowed by how awesome the user community *and Ableton suppport* is.

I'm excited to get to the bottom of this :D !
• Mac Pro (5.1) Xeon Quad-Core 2.8GHz | 8 GB RAM | 2x 1TB HD | 10.6.8
• Live Suite 9.0.4
• ProFire 2626
• Moog Little Phatty SE-II - Arturia MiniBrute - Roland JX-3P (w/PG-200) - Nord Electro 2 "Sixty one" - Roland GAIA SH-01

SKAGGS
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by SKAGGS » Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:25 pm

I popped over to Fry's the other day and bought an IEEE1394 (400) PCI-E card to test if it was a FW 400 vs 800 compatibility issue. As it turns out, it is not the problem. The 800 to 400 converter cable makes no difference, nor does going from the FW 400 port on the back of the 2626 to the MacPro's FW800 port..

I've also removed the preferences, and all the other suggested bits to remove from things like the cache folder etc.. To no avail.

I am 100% convinced it's an OS X 10.6.6 vs Profire Software v2.3.1 issue.


I'll keep updating this post..

KS.
• Mac Pro (5.1) Xeon Quad-Core 2.8GHz | 8 GB RAM | 2x 1TB HD | 10.6.8
• Live Suite 9.0.4
• ProFire 2626
• Moog Little Phatty SE-II - Arturia MiniBrute - Roland JX-3P (w/PG-200) - Nord Electro 2 "Sixty one" - Roland GAIA SH-01

[nme]
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by [nme] » Thu Mar 03, 2011 4:26 pm

Ableton Support can determine how Live is interacting with your system and peripherals by looking into one of your Status Reports.

You can create one by following these steps:
http://www.ableton.com/support/contact_ ... ort-live-8

Simply attach it to an email with a brief summary of what you described above. It won't be long before they get back in touch, and it might save you from purchasing any new gear.

support@ableton.com

SKAGGS
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Re: ProFire 2626 with Ableton Live 8 Issues

Post by SKAGGS » Fri Mar 04, 2011 6:24 pm

[nme] wrote:Ableton Support can determine how Live is interacting with your system and peripherals by looking into one of your Status Reports.

You can create one by following these steps:
http://www.ableton.com/support/contact_ ... ort-live-8

Simply attach it to an email with a brief summary of what you described above. It won't be long before they get back in touch, and it might save you from purchasing any new gear.

support@ableton.com

Thanks! However, I'm a bit ahead of you there - Ableton support has issued me both a Beta Version (8.2.2.B3) and a case number to reference every time I send in a report. (which is about 3 a day since Feb 15th) - They're either sick of me, or excited that they can get down to the microscopic levels of what's going on with my system..

Still open to suggestions as to what I can do to fix this.. That, or I'm just stuck and waiting for the next update to both Ableton and or the Profire 2626.
• Mac Pro (5.1) Xeon Quad-Core 2.8GHz | 8 GB RAM | 2x 1TB HD | 10.6.8
• Live Suite 9.0.4
• ProFire 2626
• Moog Little Phatty SE-II - Arturia MiniBrute - Roland JX-3P (w/PG-200) - Nord Electro 2 "Sixty one" - Roland GAIA SH-01

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