Live 9 Please Have These Features

Share what you’d like to see added to Ableton Live.
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mattverzola
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Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by mattverzola » Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:48 am

1) Fix the automation delay. This is the biggest hurdle I have with Live, the biggest single issue that causes me headaches and makes me think of Live as anything less than a professional piece of software. I work on my projects on multiple computers, and as the lag changes on those systems my automation changes its sync. Even on a 1 system setup, as my project grows and the lag increases, I have to rewrite my automation to adapt. PLEASE FIX THIS.

2) I want a hotkey for deactivate clip or note. You can choose, Ableton, I don't care. Make it something obscure, something stupid, whatever...just have a hotkey for the love of god. I hate right-clicking to use this feature as it's something I use often.

3) 64 bit architecture. I think I read that plugin compatibility might be an issue with this, but it is a worthy goal and the solution could be something similar to what Logic does and by having a 64bit "mode."

4) Re-work the freezing process. Specifically when sidechaining is involved. The program tells me why I can't freeze a track when what I want is for it to make the Freeze happen. It is hell to re-route my entire project to accommodate the requirement to Freeze.

5) MP3 Export, and other format options.

Final Thoughts-

I love the work you've done with Cycling 74, but now what I really desire from Live is a focus on performance. Both from ease of use and from the architecture of the program itself.

Thanks!

mbird21
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by mbird21 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:28 pm

+1 on points 4&5 from above.

Everyone knows how much i love Ableton and would not swap it for any other software, its second nature to me now lol.

That said the freezing sidechaining compression problem mentioned above really can get annoying especially if im mixing trance and wants to render several tracks for audio to free up cpu room, though it sounds difficuly to do cause imagine rhe compression is in real time so you would need to capture the precise m/s of every beat, not sure how practical it is but it is frustrating especially on trance, sure more experienced guys on here have ways wroking round that. Could ofc render as audio track in itself side chain recorded and bring it back in but thats not point i want to freeze it so at mixdown stage i might remove or change settings as different things added later.

MP3 conversion option would be perfect!, save a whole load of time then bouncing down from wav to mp3 especially when you want to just say export a small section to send a freind etc but the wav file is massive, would be a great feature!.

Aslo i would love more automation tools, something to make automation less fiddly, i find automation when you do it manually can be bit tough sometimes, some shapes like in Cubase before would be a good feature.

Other then that like said wouldnt change it for world fellas :).
Alex!

beubbo
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by beubbo » Thu Sep 15, 2011 5:06 am

Freezing several tracks at once could be also ütterkool (like in Logik Stüdio Acht8 oder Neun9... hehe)

RD444
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by RD444 » Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:24 am

beubbo wrote:Freezing several tracks at once could be also ütterkool (like in Logik Stüdio Acht8 oder Neun9... hehe)
its possible to freeze several tracks at once ..isn't it?

CTRL select them or something

----------


@OP

+1

Side chain not freezing or converting is a pain

(I remember good old cubase "you cant add audio to a MIDI track" error message, annoying me!. in Live it just converts it to an audio track if its empty.)

Live should just intelligently do something to side chained tracks. side will probably be out of fashion in 2035 by the time they implement it lol :)
"Plugin Delay compensation -PDC WARNING - Ableton Live 9 does not sequence all information correctly in time"
The bigger the project the more out of time it will be.

rchrdnsh
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by rchrdnsh » Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:30 am

+a gazillion for the Automation Delay, or in this case the non-delay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I've contacted them and gotten pretty deep into their company regarding this and the best answer I've gotten is they know it's a problem and they're working on it, but it's not a high priority, WHICH IS INSANE!

INSANE!

mattverzola
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by mattverzola » Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:04 pm

Not a priority, seriously??

I consider the automation delay to be the single biggest fault of Live at this moment. Did anyone see Deadmau5's post on Ableton recently? Here's what he wrote:

The questions was, "What's your favorite aspect of Ableton and what's your biggest gripe with Ableton?"
His answer was,
"pro: free-ish audio routing with the con of epic plugin delay compensation issues when you start bussing groups.
con: lack of internal modulation between VST params… such as triggers / envelope triggers / step sequencers to communicate to X params within the host and 3rd party plugs. They had the right idea with “stackable instruments” just lack of a decent modulation section."

His "con" I honestly don't have issue with, but I'm sure it should be improved upon. But front and center in his "pro"(!) is delay compensation (thought admittedly he may be talking about general audio delay, not automation delay). There's a lot of focus at Ableton on interesting features and creative integration with Max, but what I'd like to see is some of the bread and butter technologies being improved upon. Automation delay causes all sorts of hazards during arranging, and audio delay causes phasing issues which totally undermine the 32bit architecture.

As an aside, to amend my original post, the automation delay is consistent across multiple computers because it's the ms delay caused by the plugins, not computer performance.

RD444
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by RD444 » Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:31 pm

mattverzola wrote:1) Fix the automation delay. This is the biggest hurdle I have with Live, the biggest single issue that causes me headaches and makes me think of Live as anything less than a professional piece of software. I work on my projects on multiple computers, and as the lag changes on those systems my automation changes its sync. Even on a 1 system setup, as my project grows and the lag increases, I have to rewrite my automation to adapt. PLEASE FIX THIS.
I started a new post on automation delay (so as not to hijack this one

Is this a problem on all systems?

topic is here:

Do LIVEs automations or tempo SYNCed plugs go out of time?
http://forum.ableton.com/viewtopic.php? ... 6#p1387996
"Plugin Delay compensation -PDC WARNING - Ableton Live 9 does not sequence all information correctly in time"
The bigger the project the more out of time it will be.

mattverzola
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by mattverzola » Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:41 pm

There's a lack of functionality with Live in that it doesn't alter plugin automation to compensate for delay introduced by plugins. So the more plugins you add, the more your automation (of all sorts, even volume automation) will be off. By its nature, this lack of functionality will cause this issue to be present regardless of the system you're using.

Ableton, please fix this.

RD444
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by RD444 » Fri Mar 16, 2012 12:08 am

mattverzola wrote:There's a lack of functionality with Live in that it doesn't alter plugin automation to compensate for delay introduced by plugins. So the more plugins you add, the more your automation (of all sorts, even volume automation) will be off. By its nature, this lack of functionality will cause this issue to be present regardless of the system you're using.

Ableton, please fix this.
woooah WTF

so fast automation and many plugins is not a way to use Live.

will more plugins make it play out of sync in these examples:
1) a tempo synced Plug, like a fast LFO filter?
2) 'per part' Volume changes i have drawn in with pencil?

or is it just the automation on the main page?
"Plugin Delay compensation -PDC WARNING - Ableton Live 9 does not sequence all information correctly in time"
The bigger the project the more out of time it will be.

mattverzola
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by mattverzola » Fri Mar 16, 2012 1:05 am

I'm glad this issue is getting attention because it increases the likelihood of it getting fixed in the next version.

As far as I've seen, it only affects automation, not synced LFOs or other "internal" plugin parameters. I know it affects track automation, and I *think* it affects clip automation. I have some big sessions sometimes, and I've noticed it can be as much as a beat off (at 128 bpm). Remember we're talking about plugin delay, so we're talking milliseconds...but they can add up.

I personally wouldn't let it discourage you from using Live for complex arrangements because Live has other unique benefits like rackable instruments and effects, flexible time-stretching, and very easy to draw and edit automation (delay issues aside). The delay is an issue I've learned to deal with, and I don't ever worry about it until I hear it, like a filter "off" command making a clip sound. Since I know what's causing it I just nudge my automation a little later in time and all is well again.

To shamelessly plug my music, check out my soundcloud at http://www.soundcloud.com/2Beeps where I've made all my tunes with Live, and they are very automation intensive with lots of plugins.

RD444
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by RD444 » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:38 pm

ableton PDF manual (not in the paper manual) wrote:16.5 Device Delay Compensation


Note: there are a few situations in which Live cannot compensate for plug-in delay:
• Automation is not delay compensated. As a result, when using automation on tracks
that contain devices that cause delays, the automation may sound early.
• Tempo-synced effects and other devices that get timing information from Live's internal
clock may sound out of sync if they are placed in a device chain after devices which
cause delay.


I'm still getting my head round what 'does' and 'doesn't' increase it.

I understand plugin latency and PDC (just about)

What will push the 'automation' and 'plugin tempo sync' to go out of sync?
  • is it "Per track basis"
  • or can 'any amount of plug-in latency' in the project, push the whole project out of sync
  • Can the master channel with latency plugs on it push the projects automation and plug sync out of sync
  • Does record enable affect this delay
  • is drawn in pencil volume, pitch etc on a clip affected
  • Apart from any automation ,volume, Synced Plugins what else won't LIVE sequencer sequence in time?

Also i don't completely understand why placing a 'latency plugin' before or after would make a difference?

• Tempo-synced effects and other devices that get timing information from Live’s internal
clock may sound out of sync if they are placed in a device chain after devices which
cause delay.
"Plugin Delay compensation -PDC WARNING - Ableton Live 9 does not sequence all information correctly in time"
The bigger the project the more out of time it will be.

mattverzola
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Location: Brooklyn, NY
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by mattverzola » Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:44 pm

Great questions. I didn't even realize they acknowledged this in the manual...sheesh...

RD444
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Re: Live 9 Please Have These Features

Post by RD444 » Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:00 pm

mattverzola wrote:Great questions. I didn't even realize they acknowledged this in the manual...sheesh...
Only in the pdf manual not the paper one!
"Plugin Delay compensation -PDC WARNING - Ableton Live 9 does not sequence all information correctly in time"
The bigger the project the more out of time it will be.

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