Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Share your wishes for the future of Ableton Live
Stromkraft
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by Stromkraft » Thu May 11, 2017 11:42 am

Martin Gifford wrote:I think as a minimum, they should allow you to swap the compulsory sharps to flats in the midi editor. As it is, working in keys that have flats means you have to do extra thinking converting the scale to a sharps equivalent.
Yeah.
Make some music!

laconic001
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by laconic001 » Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:56 pm

Reviving this because I think it's essential in a next upgrade.

Thanks drzoom for putting this together.

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alex-weej
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by alex-weej » Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:10 am

I usually just play in C or Am and transpose to desired key, but once you're in the MIDI editor you're stuck with carefully dodging notes. Especially when hand editing notes during playback you have to hear the wrong note as you drag notes around, which is annoying (I want note preview to hear the note I'm looking for!)

Maybe a Max patch on every single MIDI channel to transpose from C or Am would help.

Also interesting that Push has strong support for key but Live itself doesn't...

+1000 :)

Cfig8
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by Cfig8 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:31 pm

:D I just found out about this thread, this will be a major step for Ableton, I don't know why they haven't incorporate this into Live.

soundfx
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by soundfx » Tue Mar 06, 2018 4:09 pm

+1

mxcreep
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by mxcreep » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:30 am

And a +1 from me

InLight-Tone
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by InLight-Tone » Tue Mar 20, 2018 2:43 pm

+1 here too. Look at Tracktions Waveform chord track and functions. Max is embedded now, should be easy peasy...

creativespiral
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by creativespiral » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:02 pm

+1 Great ideas ... would be very useful for composition.

nonchai
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by nonchai » Sun Mar 25, 2018 5:42 pm

I support your ideas 100%.

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I might add that a BandInABox or iReal Pro-style Chord-sheet-mode chord progression editor would be useful in addition to a more basic chord time-line approach.

The other feature request - this time under the hood that I've already passed on to Ableton concerns the need to make some modifications to the current Max4Live. Currently there is a separation between MIDI events encountered in M4L from any MIDI note actually belonging in a clip. One has to work out by convoluted means which actual NOTE object in a clip any MIDI event encountered in MAX in real-time the MIDI decent corresponds to.

Now that Max4Live is integrated much more tightly with Ableton - it ought to be possible trace from any MIDI note in M4L which note event in which MIDI clip the note on/off event corresponds to imply by means of some kind of metadata, or reference.

The reason for this is that when it comes to certain complex note/scale/chord type reharmonisation algorithms - including ones i've written already in C++ - not only the note but what position it plays in the CLIP timeline. This is because a simple dumb approach where the note always gets just remapped in exactly the same way - regardless of its position in a clip won't work for reharmonisation techniques that strive to me more musical and melodic


here is a link to my feature request concerning this. It has more to do with reharmonisation on the fly but still counts as part of a package of more harmony-related feature suggestions like the OP here.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=229490&start=0

pistacchioso
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by pistacchioso » Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:47 pm

The original post is now five years old, and still this is one of the features I see requested more often. Personally, this is my most-missed feature.
While versatile in amazing ways, Ableton Live is quite clearly thought for electronic musicians first. The "live set" features, the built-in instruments, the "play in key" feature of Push.
Unlike classically trained musicians, many electronic musicians are self-thought bedroom producers that just know the very basic of music theory. Having Ableton Live help you staying in key, choose correct chords is essential to the program, I think.

re:dream
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by re:dream » Tue May 01, 2018 7:45 am

I dunno. It's all about the trade off between flexibility and ease of use. The moment you start implementing a detailed system like this, you have to make all kinds of assumptions about what people will be wanting to do, and how they want to use the software.

In this particular case, you will be funneling people into a particular (broadly practiced, but still fairly specific) approach to composing and songwriting.

Learn music theory. It's not that difficult.

Also, the proposed approach, which will require quite an extensive redesign of basic features (flags for what kind of track it is, drum tracks, etc etc) will do absolutely nothing to help people who are USING INSTRUMENTS to make music. It's completely focused on the piano roll. So it will be great if you draw notes in with your mouse, but the usability will radically diminish the moment I am using a keyboard. My fingers will still need to know where to go.

Finally, if you really want this functionality, most of it is already there, in the Scale midi app.

So I completely understand the reason for Ableton not adopting these changes. They have given enormous thought to creating a software environment that is very 'open' in character, and which does not impose creative choices. And while the proposed approach is well worked out and clever within its limitations, I certainly don't need it.

Dancho
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by Dancho » Tue May 22, 2018 9:38 pm

This would be fantastic to be implemented in Ableton !!!

soundfx
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by soundfx » Thu May 31, 2018 10:54 am

Look at StudioOne4 and do something like that. Brilliant.

Stromkraft
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by Stromkraft » Fri Jun 01, 2018 2:14 pm

pistacchioso wrote:Having Ableton Live help you staying in key, choose correct chords is essential to the program, I think.
Po, you don't need to stay in key. Po, there are no so called "correct chords" that anyone but you can decide on. Correct is what sounds good to you.
Make some music!

Shokol8
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Re: Key Scale and Chord Tracks to Improve Composing

Post by Shokol8 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 2:56 am

+1
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