Hi!
Love ableton live! Its great! This is an idea for further development of ableton live.
I posted a while ago regarding sends within an instrument rack. One developer awnsered the post saying that would be a great supplement for the instrument racks (should have posted this at the old post, but I can't seam to find it).
The other day, I realized that it might be possible to use the external audio device for this by sending audio from within the instrument rack to a return track. The only problem is that the external audio effect dont allow me to send audio to a track (only external outs).
Allow send from an external audio effect to an internal track should be pretty quick to implement since it already is possible from an audio track. And it would ad a lot flexibility to the user. There might be other applications where sending fram one track to another would be a great feature.
I hope you would consider adding this to your developing list. Thanks!
Internal audio on the external audio effect.
Re: Internal audio on the external audio effect.
Once upon a time it is rumoured that they considered an AudioSend device, I think they may have soon realised that latency calculation with such a device might soon become incalculable.
Therefore this never happened.
Imagine we send from a rack chain on track 1 to track 2, into a rack with three parallel chains, then out of chains 2 and 3 back to track 1 into a different chain which runs parallel to the initial chain.
That latency calc would be a tough one. Very very tough. And educating the users would be even more difficult.
Most users dont understand the PDC on return channels.
All that said: I would love audio and control routing devices
Therefore this never happened.
Imagine we send from a rack chain on track 1 to track 2, into a rack with three parallel chains, then out of chains 2 and 3 back to track 1 into a different chain which runs parallel to the initial chain.
That latency calc would be a tough one. Very very tough. And educating the users would be even more difficult.
Most users dont understand the PDC on return channels.
All that said: I would love audio and control routing devices
Re: Internal audio on the external audio effect.
So the argument is that allowing the user full flexibility could potentially put the user in a situation with to much latency, is that correct?
But it is posible to send from one track to another track allready. The argument should be aplied there as well. I could send from one track through a bunch of effects, to another track through a bunch of effect and so on eventually ending up at the same track, wich should result in a lot of latency, right?
But it is posible to send from one track to another track allready. The argument should be aplied there as well. I could send from one track through a bunch of effects, to another track through a bunch of effect and so on eventually ending up at the same track, wich should result in a lot of latency, right?
Re: Internal audio on the external audio effect.
The issue would be everything going out of time and with no decent way to put it all back in time.
Its not that the issue is a large amount of latency, but that the latency amount in matrices is nearly impossible to calculate.
In the current situation Live does latency calculations and PDC (putting shit back in time) but if you route something back into itself (eg activate send A on return A) then Live will deactivate the latency calculation for that track.
The issue is two fold: first technical: what is the latency of a feedback routing?
Secondly user education: do people understand what is happening, why PDC is disabled in this case.
That last point is illustrated by your post. I'm guessing you don't know that PDC is disabled in feedback routings. Most people don't - it's complex to understand, it's one reason that other DAWS avoid this flexibility. They can't face customers complaining about something which is impossible to fix, unless you can bend time,
Its not that the issue is a large amount of latency, but that the latency amount in matrices is nearly impossible to calculate.
In the current situation Live does latency calculations and PDC (putting shit back in time) but if you route something back into itself (eg activate send A on return A) then Live will deactivate the latency calculation for that track.
The issue is two fold: first technical: what is the latency of a feedback routing?
Secondly user education: do people understand what is happening, why PDC is disabled in this case.
That last point is illustrated by your post. I'm guessing you don't know that PDC is disabled in feedback routings. Most people don't - it's complex to understand, it's one reason that other DAWS avoid this flexibility. They can't face customers complaining about something which is impossible to fix, unless you can bend time,
Re: Internal audio on the external audio effect.
Thanks for replying! I apreciate that!
So in order to get this work smoothly you would have to dissable the PDC right? And thats probebly whats happening in Reason 8 or Pro Tools then.
I also understand that implementing it (dissabeling PDC or fireing a warning or something) would be a lot of hassle as oppose to how many peaple would acctually use the features.
I tryed to read up on PDC, but I didnt find anything. Can you reffer me to an article or something?
So in order to get this work smoothly you would have to dissable the PDC right? And thats probebly whats happening in Reason 8 or Pro Tools then.
I also understand that implementing it (dissabeling PDC or fireing a warning or something) would be a lot of hassle as oppose to how many peaple would acctually use the features.
I tryed to read up on PDC, but I didnt find anything. Can you reffer me to an article or something?
Re: Internal audio on the external audio effect.
I would never deactivate PDC as that's that path to a world of hurt.
Ableton will deactivate it automatically per track in a case where thats absolutely necessary.
Every now and then I flip the play-through latency corrector off, thats the one which affects whether an armed track is in time with the rest of the tracks or is simply working as quickly as possible by ignoring all the other latencies. But I never turn the main PDC off.
It's worth mentioning that PDC is an abbreviation which came from Cubase or somewhere, so its not a great search term for Ableton, unless you want to find people asking questions. I forget what the correct ableton term is, automatic latency compensation? I dunno, it's in the menu anyway.
There's an official FAQ on latency I see, and its up to date and quite comprehensive. Well done Ableton!
https://www.ableton.com/en/help/article/latency-faqs/
Ableton will deactivate it automatically per track in a case where thats absolutely necessary.
Every now and then I flip the play-through latency corrector off, thats the one which affects whether an armed track is in time with the rest of the tracks or is simply working as quickly as possible by ignoring all the other latencies. But I never turn the main PDC off.
It's worth mentioning that PDC is an abbreviation which came from Cubase or somewhere, so its not a great search term for Ableton, unless you want to find people asking questions. I forget what the correct ableton term is, automatic latency compensation? I dunno, it's in the menu anyway.
There's an official FAQ on latency I see, and its up to date and quite comprehensive. Well done Ableton!
https://www.ableton.com/en/help/article/latency-faqs/
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ChironControl
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 10:00 am
Re: Internal audio on the external audio effect.
I would also like it very much to have sends in the instrument rack. In a drum rack it is implemented, so there is no reason to not have that same feature in an instrument rack. In the drum rack this is a really great feature.