Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Share your wishes for the future of Ableton Live
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flyweight@rocketmail.com
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Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:51 am

Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by flyweight@rocketmail.com » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:28 pm

I remember the same pain with sysex data. Which is now partly supported. But it took long. Real loooong.
MPE is getting bigger and bigger and competing DAW's do not have any issues to support it.

So I am gone. As I know ableton is slow and by the time mpe is as common as water it might appear.
Then you have to pay for just another update...

Scoox
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Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2019 3:14 am

Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by Scoox » Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:33 pm

Where to thought? Genuine question as I'm demoing Ableton at the moment.

drgania
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Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:13 pm

Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by drgania » Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:25 pm

Scoox wrote:
Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:33 pm
Where to thought? Genuine question as I'm demoing Ableton at the moment.
There is for example Logic if you’re on a Mac or Bitwig if on Windows that support it.

flyweight@rocketmail.com
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Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:51 am

Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by flyweight@rocketmail.com » Wed Dec 11, 2019 8:23 am

Yeah that is also my thought.
Going hackintosh and move back to Logic.

I remember years of request for sysex......we all know how long that took.
I am afraid MPE is going to be the same story

Scoox
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Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2019 3:14 am

Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by Scoox » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:18 am

flyweight@rocketmail.com wrote:
Wed Dec 11, 2019 8:23 am
Yeah that is also my thought.
Going hackintosh and move back to Logic.

I remember years of request for sysex......we all know how long that took.
I am afraid MPE is going to be the same story
The good news is that competitors are working hard to improve their products, which indirectly benefits Live users. I think we are going to see some amazing stuff in the next two years. I know, it sucks we can't just snap our fingers and get what we want right now. Maybe one day AI will do all the tedious coding and all we'll need to do is request features.

jonljacobi
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Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by jonljacobi » Fri Dec 13, 2019 12:29 am

Not saying it's ideal, but just so casual readers who may not know what MPE is, or how it works... You can use MPE controllers in Live by switching to multi-channel output. Same deal sound and info wise but multiple tracks, generally harder to edit though not quite so bad now that you can edit multiple clips at the same time. I suspect that the next thing will be to allow editing multiple automation envelopes the way you can edit multiple clips which will make it easier yet, but still not ideal.

Put succinctly, if you're very good with an MPE controller and don't need to edit much, it's fine once you have it set up. If you futz around with your controller and want to edit a lot, not so fine.

Internet Culture
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Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by Internet Culture » Sat Dec 14, 2019 1:32 am

TBF, MIDI 2.0 is going to allow many, if not all, of the functions of MPE and will be coming in the next few years. An to the protocol already in use in Live seems more likely than the addition of an entirely new protocol. Not to say that this is something people should have to wait a few years for, but hopefully it offers up some hope :/

Machinesworking
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Location: Seattle

Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by Machinesworking » Sun Dec 15, 2019 9:53 pm

As a confirmed DAW slut I own Live Suite, Reaper, Logic X, DP10, Reason, and MPC2.
Only Logic and Reaper can do MPE, but honestly I don't use them more because they can. I have a Rise 49 here and both DP10 and Live 10 have easy solutions to MPE, With DP10 Create Tracks and Track Grouping make it less than 30 seconds to set up a folder with the VSTi and all the channels etc. With Live it's even easier thanks to a script.

https://support.roli.com/support/discus ... rl_locale=

Yes editing MPE isn't trivial, but honestly MPE is a "solo" type MIDI implementation, i.e. it's a players feature, not an editor friendly feature even in DAWs that support one MIDI track for MPE. I'll be happy when Live gets MPE, but it's not broken without it.

jonljacobi
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Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by jonljacobi » Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:24 am

MIDI 2.0 can support 16 MPE synths playing all at once. Or 256 mono synths if you prefer.

dohill06
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Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2012 1:58 am

Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by dohill06 » Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:23 am

Machinesworking wrote:
Sun Dec 15, 2019 9:53 pm
As a confirmed DAW slut I own Live Suite, Reaper, Logic X, DP10, Reason, and MPC2.
Only Logic and Reaper can do MPE, but honestly I don't use them more because they can. I have a Rise 49 here and both DP10 and Live 10 have easy solutions to MPE, With DP10 Create Tracks and Track Grouping make it less than 30 seconds to set up a folder with the VSTi and all the channels etc. With Live it's even easier thanks to a script.

https://support.roli.com/support/discus ... rl_locale=

Yes editing MPE isn't trivial, but honestly MPE is a "solo" type MIDI implementation, i.e. it's a players feature, not an editor friendly feature even in DAWs that support one MIDI track for MPE. I'll be happy when Live gets MPE, but it's not broken without it.
It's super easy to edit in Cubase with Note Expression, and in Bitwig. Just saying...

Machinesworking
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Location: Seattle

Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by Machinesworking » Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:27 pm

dohill06 wrote:
Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:23 am
It's super easy to edit in Cubase with Note Expression, and in Bitwig. Just saying...
Sure, it's just not the type of playing that IMO should be edited.
I mean why do you need MPE if you're editing it? It's basically about being able to play a part with 5 different parameters of a sound available in a hardware MIDI controller for you to manipulate in real time. You can edit 128 parameters in a soft synth if you want in Live, 500+ in other DAWs, with dozens of synth sounds etc.

I mean I sort of get it, I just think personally I'm looking for wild actual playing type changes, not micro editing etc. That's not going to be something that MPE really brings to the table, new ways to micro edit synths and samplers for cool sounds. It's more like MPE allows you to play things that sound like lots of automation editing was done in real time.

Even in Live, with 10 allowing multiple MIDI channels to be in the same MIDI editor it's not that hard to edit if you need to. Nothing about it has made me think I need to switch to Bitwig. :x

jonljacobi
Posts: 548
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Re: Goodbye Ableton: no mpe I am out

Post by jonljacobi » Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:55 pm

I can imagine the need to edit that one sour note in an otherwise sterling performance, but certainly nothing heavy. But I most imagine the need for velocity or modulation gone bad which is still going to require editing a separate track in Live.

I can definitely see why MPE users would want to record and edit on a single track. With multi channel, tracks could pile up in a hurry.

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