GROUP SOLO - come on guys - for 6.1 - demo song shows it

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forge
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GROUP SOLO - come on guys - for 6.1 - demo song shows it

Post by forge » Sat Oct 07, 2006 12:53 pm

I just loaded up the first demo song I downloaded from the Live Pack page and it has tracks routed to a sub mix track - and the first thing I went to do as soon as I opened it was solo the tracks - click solo on any track: SILENCE

this is one of the actual demo songs you are sending with Live and straight away this amazingly obvious glaring omission will be the first thing to greet ALOT of people

Hoiw can this have not been considered a priority as soon as it was possible to route tracks to other tracks??

musick
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Post by musick » Sat Oct 07, 2006 3:25 pm

This is a long standing issue, which indeed should have been fixed a long time ago. It effectively disables the use of groups :(
Very anoying.
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mercyplease
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Re: GROUP SOLO - come on guys - for 6.1 - demo song shows it

Post by mercyplease » Mon Oct 09, 2006 1:45 pm

forge wrote:I just loaded up the first demo song I downloaded from the Live Pack page and it has tracks routed to a sub mix track - and the first thing I went to do as soon as I opened it was solo the tracks - click solo on any track: SILENCE

this is one of the actual demo songs you are sending with Live and straight away this amazingly obvious glaring omission will be the first thing to greet ALOT of people

Hoiw can this have not been considered a priority as soon as it was possible to route tracks to other tracks??
To have that on the demo is a mistake or at the very least shows off the glaring oversight staright out of the box.
HA HA HA :twisted:

Chris J
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Post by Chris J » Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:49 pm

group solo please
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michkhol
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Post by michkhol » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:48 pm

Quote from the manual:
"Every return track has a Pre/Post toggle that determines if the signal a clip track sends to it is tapped before or after the mixer stage (i.e., the pan, volume and track-active controls)".

I have no idea what "track-active" controls mean (couldn't find a definition or other mention in the manual). BUT if I assume that these controls include at least solo and mute, in Pre mode they should have no effect. Currently only volume and pan are affected which is clearly a bug in this case.

If it worked like described in the manual, you could have group controls in the return track.
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forge
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Post by forge » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:47 pm

michkhol wrote:Quote from the manual:
"Every return track has a Pre/Post toggle that determines if the signal a clip track sends to it is tapped before or after the mixer stage (i.e., the pan, volume and track-active controls)".

I have no idea what "track-active" controls mean (couldn't find a definition or other mention in the manual). BUT if I assume that these controls include at least solo and mute, in Pre mode they should have no effect. Currently only volume and pan are affected which is clearly a bug in this case.

If it worked like described in the manual, you could have group controls in the return track.
as mentioned here: http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... 038#364038

you can use sends as groups, but it still doesnt really solve the problem when you solo tracks if you have an impulse routed to several tracks

really, this is a very basic function and I'm hoping Live 7 has alot of these little things that keep getting relegated but are really important

this particular thing is infuriating to me - it stops me from routing things and really means Live doesnt have the ability to have proper group tracks

abletoff
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Post by abletoff » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:24 am

yeah it will be all in L7, it will have a menacing logo too. The Abes are keeping the best for hell's heaven...
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michkhol
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Post by michkhol » Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:38 am

forge wrote:
as mentioned here: http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... 038#364038

you can use sends as groups, but it still doesnt really solve the problem when you solo tracks if you have an impulse routed to several tracks

really, this is a very basic function and I'm hoping Live 7 has alot of these little things that keep getting relegated but are really important

this particular thing is infuriating to me - it stops me from routing things and really means Live doesnt have the ability to have proper group tracks
The Impulse audio outputs are tapped pre-mixer, as my test shows in Live 6:
1. Open a new project
2. Put an Impulse preset in a MIDI track and make a test clip.
3. Create an audio track and route its input from the Impulse kick drum and call it "Kick" (for example).
4. Create another audio track and call it "Aux". Now route its input from PreFx or PostFx output of the "Kick" track.
5. Play the clip.
6. Now hit solo buttons on the Impulse and "Kick" track. It works as expected.
7. NOW hit solo button on the "Aux" track. The Impulse kick drum coninues playing.
8. Switch Pre/PostFX to PostMixer. No sound.

So if we route any track Pre Mixer to another track, soloing the latter won't mute the sound because it bypasses its own mixer completely.

Now how could we use return tracks for track grouping? By sending several tracks to it and enable Pre Send. Manual says that Pre Send mode sends the signal from the tracks Pre Mixer bypassing volume, pan and track activation controls. The first two are actually bypassed but not mute and solo! So what we have here is a BUG. Pre mode in the return track shoud tap the signal from sending tracks before any mixer controls.

If the bug is confirmed, using return tracks as track groups becomes not a feature to be implemeted but a mere bugfix.
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forge
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Post by forge » Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:19 am

yeah, I still dont want to use sends as groups

:evil:

:lol:

we need to petition hard for this because it's important and I really expected it to be in Live 6

kineticUk
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Post by kineticUk » Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:31 am

I would rather use racks to group an impulse's seperate outputs. Route the outputs individually to seperate chains, add fx, mix all the channels levels within a rack and stick the fucker into a single midi track. (Rack Improvements please have a look at my idea too.. http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=49851)
Sorry to intrude...I'll go now.
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musick
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Post by musick » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:14 am

forge wrote:yeah, I still dont want to use sends as groups

:evil:

:lol:

we need to petition hard for this because it's important and I really expected it to be in Live 6
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Chris J
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Post by Chris J » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:02 pm

forge wrote:we need to petition hard for this because it's important and I really expected it to be in Live 6
So did I.
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Pitch Black
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Post by Pitch Black » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:15 pm

Yes, to be able tap a "downstream" solo would be great!

+n+1

Chris J
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Post by Chris J » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:57 pm

of course I have no idea about programming, but would it really be hard to implement ?

I mean it's just like clicking on all related tracks, so a detection of what goes into the group doesn't sound like complicated stuff, or is it ?
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michkhol
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Post by michkhol » Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:28 pm

forge wrote:yeah, I still dont want to use sends as groups

:evil:

:lol:

we need to petition hard for this because it's important and I really expected it to be in Live 6
I'm totally with you. My point is that a bugfix has much more priority than a new feature, at least we will be able to have _something_ earlier than V7. Besides, Ableton has to fix it anyway.
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