Preset Hotswap?

Questions and discussion about building and using Max for Live devices
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zlatko
Posts: 116
Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2009 3:34 pm

Preset Hotswap?

Post by zlatko » Fri Oct 23, 2009 11:35 am

Hey guys,

please, can anyone tell me how to possibly read the available presets for a given device and hot swap one in?

Cheers

z
Who else has been sick of 4/4 for the last 10 years ??

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Gregory Taylor
Posts: 268
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by Gregory Taylor » Fri Oct 23, 2009 2:55 pm

Is the description in the manual not accurate? If not, what happens that you don't expect (and what platform are you using/version number, etc.)?

zlatko
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by zlatko » Sat Oct 24, 2009 10:33 am

Hi,

I could not trace anything to do with hotswap or things residing in the browser.
Maybe I am missing the 'manual' cause all I can find is some xml object references
and example patches.

Thanks

z
Who else has been sick of 4/4 for the last 10 years ??

www.zlatko.hu

Gregory Taylor
Posts: 268
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:11 pm

Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by Gregory Taylor » Sat Oct 24, 2009 10:49 pm

oh - you mean using the Live API for that?

No way to do it - there's not a mechanism for looking at the File browser
listings for devices or files of any kind. I thought you meant hotswapping
presets manually.

zlatko
Posts: 116
Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2009 3:34 pm

Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by zlatko » Sun Oct 25, 2009 7:30 am

Oh bother, then I will have to make my presets with hose untransparent envelopes and their +50% -50% ranges... :(
Who else has been sick of 4/4 for the last 10 years ??

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vanceg
Posts: 130
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 6:46 pm

Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by vanceg » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:36 pm

Gregory Taylor wrote:oh - you mean using the Live API for that?

No way to do it - there's not a mechanism for looking at the File browser
listings for devices or files of any kind. I thought you meant hotswapping
presets manually.
I sure do wish there was SOME way to switch presets for Effects and Instruments in Live without having to touch the mouse. I have long been baffled that nobody but me seems to want/need a way to switch presets using, for example, MIDI Program Change messages. I, too, was hoping there would be a way to read the presets available for any given device and recall them using M4L.

How can it be that MANY people aren't asking for this feature? Does everyone have their hands free to use the mouse to swap effect presets?

Vance
Latptop:
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zlatko
Posts: 116
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by zlatko » Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:04 am

Yeah,

it is the first thing I want in a live processing set to start with,
if we make some noise maybe we will be heard....

NOISE
NOISE
NOISE
NOISE
NOISE
NOISE

z
Who else has been sick of 4/4 for the last 10 years ??

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hoffman2k
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by hoffman2k » Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:46 am

vanceg wrote:
Gregory Taylor wrote:oh - you mean using the Live API for that?

No way to do it - there's not a mechanism for looking at the File browser
listings for devices or files of any kind. I thought you meant hotswapping
presets manually.
I sure do wish there was SOME way to switch presets for Effects and Instruments in Live without having to touch the mouse. I have long been baffled that nobody but me seems to want/need a way to switch presets using, for example, MIDI Program Change messages. I, too, was hoping there would be a way to read the presets available for any given device and recall them using M4L.

How can it be that MANY people aren't asking for this feature? Does everyone have their hands free to use the mouse to swap effect presets?

Vance
Have you checked the feature request list. We ask every year. We also posted lengthy rants about Live having less midi capabilities than a 25 year old sequencer.

As for what we do to work around it, we load instrument racks and use the chain selector as a program change of sorts.

pukunui
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Location: Los Angeles

Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by pukunui » Tue Oct 27, 2009 3:07 pm

vst~ works fine inside MFL devices.

-A

stefan-tiedje
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Location: Berlin

Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by stefan-tiedje » Tue Oct 27, 2009 4:00 pm

pukunui wrote:vst~ works fine inside MFL devices.
Inside MFL you can also use the old fashioned preset object or a pattrstoarge. This has the advantage that you will have a single file for all presets instead of one file for each preset...;-)
But I guess the feature request should cover non MFL devices as well...

Stefan
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vanceg
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by vanceg » Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:48 pm

hoffman2k wrote:
vanceg wrote:
Gregory Taylor wrote:oh - you mean using the Live API for that?

Have you checked the feature request list. We ask every year. We also posted lengthy rants about Live having less midi capabilities than a 25 year old sequencer.

As for what we do to work around it, we load instrument racks and use the chain selector as a program change of sorts.
Of course - My comment was somewhat rhetorical; I know there are a group of us who are interested in this feature. I'm just startled that this isn't a larger deal to a larger number of users. That's it.

I love the Chain feature. However, this is not really a reasonable option in my situation because I'd quickly run out of processing power since all devices inserted on a chain seem to use CPU resources even if they aren't currently selected in a chain.

It's a sticky question, though: I can see how supporting preset swapping via MIDI can open up a can of worms. You'd have to address issues like: Does every instance of a particular plugin have the same set of presets it can recall? Do ALL instances of the plugin respond to the same Program Change messages or does each instance respond to messages on a unique MIDI channel? How does one define the similarities and differences in response to Program Change between multiple instances of the same plugin? And so on.

Anyway - There are lots of desired features, each of which is "Totally Critical" to those who feel they 'need' it. This happens to be one I 'need' so it's highly important ;-)

Seriously, though, thanks for the suggestion of the Chain work-around. That sort of advice is always appreciated!
Latptop:
MacBook Pro 2.33, RME Fireface 400, iPad running TouchOSC, VG-99 processor, SoftStep foot pedal (2)


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hoffman2k
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by hoffman2k » Tue Oct 27, 2009 6:23 pm

vanceg wrote: Of course - My comment was somewhat rhetorical; I know there are a group of us who are interested in this feature. I'm just startled that this isn't a larger deal to a larger number of users. That's it.

I love the Chain feature. However, this is not really a reasonable option in my situation because I'd quickly run out of processing power since all devices inserted on a chain seem to use CPU resources even if they aren't currently selected in a chain.

It's a sticky question, though: I can see how supporting preset swapping via MIDI can open up a can of worms. You'd have to address issues like: Does every instance of a particular plugin have the same set of presets it can recall? Do ALL instances of the plugin respond to the same Program Change messages or does each instance respond to messages on a unique MIDI channel? How does one define the similarities and differences in response to Program Change between multiple instances of the same plugin? And so on.

Anyway - There are lots of desired features, each of which is "Totally Critical" to those who feel they 'need' it. This happens to be one I 'need' so it's highly important ;-)

Seriously, though, thanks for the suggestion of the Chain work-around. That sort of advice is always appreciated!
I'm sure program changes or a more elegant solution is high up their list. But you gotta admit, when your application is called Live you better have a very smooth and user friendly solution. If they do it the way it is in Linear DAWs or (shudder) Roland grooveboxes, pitchforks will be raised.

I can't even make a proper argument about having faith in Ableton anymore without coming across like a total fanboy. Since I literally got most of my requests granted with M4L. Its hard for me to take the look of somebody who has not had his way now.
Program changes are still high up on my list. But now I know what M4L can do I want them to also consider the solution to include a way to dynamically load samples into Live with M4L. Because where do you make the distinction between an instrument and a set of clips with effects that is played like an instrument?

Or in other words, wouldn't the solution be to allow us to create preset bank files. Something you load with your set and somehow manages itself in a way that it only uses the CPU you need and keeps all the rest pre-loaded and ready to go without taking up resources. I guess this last bit is rhetorical because there are plenty of solutions and equally as much problems.

zlatko
Posts: 116
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by zlatko » Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:07 pm

nice little noise... :)

My hope lies in the almighty Abe who sees all the requests and knows what makes sense better than any of us.

I would love to see the Force button on the envelopes, that would block the controlled parameter and show the actual absolute values of it rather than a beautiful palette of -50%-50%, 0%-100% & -127-127.

Also, please a '2env' button just left of hotswap that would store all the tweaked parameters into the current clips envelope,
so that we can trigger that preset.

does this smell of worms too?

z
Who else has been sick of 4/4 for the last 10 years ??

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Per Boysen
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Re: Preset Hotswap?

Post by Per Boysen » Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:00 pm

Found this thread through a search three years later :-) Seems the situation has not changed. I'm using the excellent sbx 2049 skinnerbox drum seq device and can't manage to map external audio to recall a particular preset. Have tried the rack/chain method and have tried with the Kapture M4L device. Neither works in this case. Only solution seems to be bending over to the laptop on stage to watch the screen and use the mouse manually. No fun.
Greetings from Sweden

Per Boysen
http://www.perboysen.com

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