a question regarding control surfaces

Questions and discussion about building and using Max for Live devices
3dot...
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a question regarding control surfaces

Post by 3dot... » Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:59 pm

can I somehow get a 'list' of the 8 tracks currently controlled by my launchpad/sl25..?
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chapelier fou
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by chapelier fou » Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:50 pm

i'd be interested too....
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chapelier fou
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by chapelier fou » Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:51 pm

did you try what the LOM Navigator from shelluser says ?
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S4racen
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by S4racen » Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:19 pm

If you send a bang to a live object focused on the right component of the control surface with a message get track offset you'll get the position of the first track, a few + objects and 8 live.objects and you'll be able to get name....

Wasn't aware that the sl25 had a red box? I do this easily with the launch pad and have it update by observing the left and right bank buttons in session mode, each press sends a bang to update the track offset....

Cheers
D

3dot...
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by 3dot... » Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:31 pm

S4racen wrote:If you send a bang to a live object focused on the right component of the control surface with a message get track offset you'll get the position of the first track, a few + objects and 8 live.objects and you'll be able to get name....

Wasn't aware that the sl25 had a red box? I do this easily with the launch pad and have it update by observing the left and right bank buttons in session mode, each press sends a bang to update the track offset...
Cheers
D
thanks .. what do you mean by "right component of the control surface "..
and no the sl doesn't have a 'box'..but the mixer handles banks of 8..
so that would be kind of easy ..to know the tracks ..but how do I know which bank it's on?
what's the 1st track on the sliders?
what's the 1st on the launchpad mixer?
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S4racen
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by S4racen » Thu Nov 10, 2011 8:10 am

You'll need to use the Shelusers device, you're looking for the component that has a function of call_track_offset

If you have a look at my Isotonik Lite Device you'll see how i do it for the APC40... The Octop4d Lite device does the same and was designed as a starting point for anyone wanting to build their own version....

As far as i'm aware each time you change to a new device it jumps to bank one, you'd need to rest to zero and listen to the buttons that you use to switch between the banks to then use that number to make your display, banks of controls dont have names to my knowledge... I don't know the sl25 so i cant help much more than that i'm afraid....

Cheers
D

3dot...
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by 3dot... » Thu Nov 10, 2011 8:27 am

hmmm..I see..
so I have to keep track of the navigation buttons pressed on the launchpad...
and figure out which track I'm on..
not exactly ideal...
I would think there should be a more straight-forward way...

I'll have to further investigate... I'll check out your patch too D...thanks !!
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amounra93
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by amounra93 » Thu Nov 10, 2011 9:43 am

You don't have to 'keep track of them' necessarily, you just use them as a trigger to update the info about your position. There are better ways, but they require hot-rodding the Python script...

As far as the SL, it's not _Framework, so m4l doesn't even recognize it (unless something has changed since I sold my SL, and I don't think it has). That means you're going to get butkis from it by trying to use the API.
http://www.aumhaa.com for Monomod and other m4l goodies.

S4racen
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by S4racen » Thu Nov 10, 2011 10:22 am

Keep track of them = live.observer them... As far as i'm aware the track_offset is not something that can be observed so to make sure you follow it when you move the only way is to update it when you physically interact with the controls that can move it...

Cheers
D

3dot...
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by 3dot... » Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:04 pm

I see.. butkis hmm
this is turning out to be more than I bargained for.. this is supposed to be simple no ?
I don't get it the sl and Lp both have custom scripts corresponding with the same API..
so why ?!

in general regards to m4l.. almost everytime I start developing something in m4l.. I hit a wall..
either because the documentation isn't focused..
or because it simply is unable to do seamingly simple tasks..
or because it does them poorly performance wise..
disappointing ..frustrating to say the least..

this would be a good example..

I need the control to change when :
1. moving tracks around
2.moving the Launchpad grid around..

live already updates the controls when I do those 2 actions
what I want :
2 controllers need to 'follow' what the 1 controller (Launchpad) is doing..and react..
in any programming environment API (with the right 'hooks' in place... )
I should be able to get this done in 5 mins.
after all ... this isn't rocket science..(once the hooks are there)
I guess m4l/liveAPI is still a long ways from being straightforward ..

I simply wanted to give the bcr and sl the same 'offset' as the Launchpad...
using the bcr to auto-magically map to the sends corresponding to the Launchpad tracks..which are simply 8 adjacent tracks
and sl for the mixer bits..
(the sl controlls the returns and master track in addition)..

didn't get your patch yet D.. I'll do it when I get home..

thanks for your help guys .. keep 'em coming if you have any more ideas..
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S4racen
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by S4racen » Thu Nov 10, 2011 1:35 pm

Stupid question but BCR has how many encoders?? and do they get midi feedback like the apc40??

Should be relatively easy yet time consuming to knock together,,,,

Cheers
D

chapelier fou
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by chapelier fou » Thu Nov 10, 2011 2:01 pm

3dot... wrote:I see.. butkis hmm
this is turning out to be more than I bargained for.. this is supposed to be simple no ?
I don't get it the sl and Lp both have custom scripts corresponding with the same API..
so why ?!

in general regards to m4l.. almost everytime I start developing something in m4l.. I hit a wall..
either because the documentation isn't focused..
or because it simply is unable to do seamingly simple tasks..
or because it does them poorly performance wise..
disappointing ..frustrating to say the least..

this would be a good example..

I need the control to change when :
1. moving tracks around
2.moving the Launchpad grid around..

live already updates the controls when I do those 2 actions
what I want :
2 controllers need to 'follow' what the 1 controller (Launchpad) is doing..and react..
in any programming environment API (with the right 'hooks' in place... )
I should be able to get this done in 5 mins.
after all ... this isn't rocket science..(once the hooks are there)
I guess m4l/liveAPI is still a long ways from being straightforward ..

I simply wanted to give the bcr and sl the same 'offset' as the Launchpad...
using the bcr to auto-magically map to the sends corresponding to the Launchpad tracks..which are simply 8 adjacent tracks
and sl for the mixer bits..
(the sl controlls the returns and master track in addition)..

didn't get your patch yet D.. I'll do it when I get home..

thanks for your help guys .. keep 'em coming if you have any more ideas..
What you wanna do is interesting !
Are you using the BCR like a regular controller or as a control surface ? if like a regular controller my idea would to change the channel of every encoder using two IAC buses (one for the IN, one for the OUT)? OR, can presets on the BCR be changed via sysex ? Just throwing ideas, that's all (got not so much time, should be rehearsing)
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3dot...
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by 3dot... » Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:25 pm

no.. tbe bcr preset would be set to 1ch. say 16..

the mapping in the m4l patch will change...

.no need the 'control surface ' for the bcr (only 'track' input/output )

intended to give me control of up to 6 sends per track ..
plus a bank 8 knobs for automapping to device on the latest send moved ..

I just want to switch banks on one device ..and have the others change as well ..
not switch 3 different devices manually ..
as far as I can tell the sl25 will be the main issue ..
should I stop using the sl native remote script alltogether?
if so..how will I get the parameter/track names to show on the sl?
I might contact Novation about this one ...or maybe Ableton support (?)
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S4racen
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by S4racen » Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:57 pm

So let me just check....

Bcr has 8 banks of 6 encoders... So sends A to F for the 8 tracks of the current redbox of the Launchpad which moves and the bcf will always be the 8 tracks....

Then another 8 macro style encoders on the bcf that automap to the first rack within the return of the last send moved, eg send c on track three move so the 8 macro knobs map to the first rack on return C?

I've no knowledge of how to get the track names to the SL, i can get them and put them in a textbox or something?

When do you need it for??

Cheers
D

3dot...
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Re: a question regarding control surfaces

Post by 3dot... » Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:24 am

hehe ..
no bcf.. bcr launchpad and remoteSl..
bcr has the lower section : 3 sends x 8 tracks..
the upper section has 4 banks of 8 knobs/buttons..
(3 for sends D-F across 8 tracks.. 1 for device control)

I'm in no rush.. it's just something I'm currently scheming...
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