* Making a guitar sound real *

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bigbonthabeat
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* Making a guitar sound real *

Post by bigbonthabeat » Mon Nov 24, 2008 2:48 am

Does anyone have tips (or links to websites), that show how to play your midi keyboard to sound like a real guitar? I have guitar rig so that should help, but what I want to know is tips on how to play the keyboard and use the pitch bend.

Anyone got suggestions?

thanks :D

pepezabala
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Post by pepezabala » Mon Nov 24, 2008 10:53 am

well, first you need to specify a little on which type of guitar sound you want to play? If its a heavily distorted lead guitar, then any synth lead through guitar rig will give good results, if it is flamenco style nylon guitar, then you will have to work a little bit more ...

Which (virtual) instruments do you have? Tension? Sampler? Simpler?

You want to have chords strumming? Then you should have a look on how chords are structured on a guitar ..

you want melodies Eric clapton style? Then check pentatonic scales.

Da hand
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Post by Da hand » Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:12 pm

For any instrument emulation, you need to research the instrument extensively if you want to have any realistic results. Basically, look at all the factors that make up the sound you are after.

...a guitar gets complicated very quickly, as it has many more parameters than a keyboard in terms of articulation.

To start with the sound...

For a guitar, it depends if you want an electric (distorted or clean), acoustic or classical guitar sound. Then in each category it depends on the type of instrument sound you are after - for example a Gibson Les Paul (long sustain, warm sound) will sound very different than a Fender Strat (shorter sustain, more twangy sound).

Let us say, you narrowed it down to a Gibson Les Paul sound. Which type of pickup setting would you want? A warmer neck setting, a harder bridge setting? Something in-between? Many players even switch pickup settings between phrases (or play closer to the neck or bridge). Which leads me into the next consideration.

What phrasing style and music style are you after. A blues guitar lick will sound different than jazz, for example. Also BB king will sound different than Clapton. These considerations will play into the way you try to emulate note bends, vibrato, palm-muting of strings, harmonics (natural or with a pic / fingernail), finger/pic scrapes on the strings, etc.

All this to say, that an instrument like a guitar is not easy to emulate with a keyboard if you plan to go beyond playing simple notes with not many articulations. For strums and chords it is not too bad. For soloing, it will be extremely difficult.

UKRuss
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Post by UKRuss » Mon Nov 24, 2008 2:20 pm

I saw the promo vid for the Reason real Bass refill, or called something like that. And I have to say, the guy was making it sound like a real bass coming from his keyboard, slides, slaps, fret noise etc.

However, having said that, i was left with the feeling that it could take as long to learn what he was doing on the keyboard as it would to learn to play the bass for real...

kraze
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Post by kraze » Mon Nov 24, 2008 4:59 pm

You're actually not asking for patches or instruments, you're pretty much just stating the most important thing.

How do you get your keyboard to sound like you're playing a guitar? PLAY IT like a guitar. Don't play it like a keyboard, be way more flexible and simulate strums and use the pitch and mod wheel extensively.

Lo-Fi Massahkah
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Post by Lo-Fi Massahkah » Mon Nov 24, 2008 8:19 pm

UKRuss wrote:However, having said that, i was left with the feeling that it could take as long to learn what he was doing on the keyboard as it would to learn to play the bass for real...
Definitely.

.m

bigbonthabeat
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Post by bigbonthabeat » Wed Nov 26, 2008 4:04 pm

thanks for all the great responses everyone :D

the similar style I'm going after is on this song

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmP51WbB4LM

(the guitar comes in somewhere after 3:00 )

I don't really know much about guitars so I need some help identifying the different articulations used in this style. Does anyone know?

thanks : )

obeyendevor
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Post by obeyendevor » Thu Nov 27, 2008 4:03 pm

cheap $100 guitar + good input + guitar rig 3 = amazing guitar sounds.

doing it on a keyboard is probably close to impossible. That Usher song sounds like a real lead guitar or maybe a Yamaha Motif. Playing guitar on keyboard (like that guy did with reason) you need to use keys, pitchbend, aftertouch, legato and mod wheel to get that sound.
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bigbonthabeat
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Post by bigbonthabeat » Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:10 pm

obeyendevor wrote:cheap $100 guitar + good input + guitar rig 3 = amazing guitar sounds.

doing it on a keyboard is probably close to impossible. That Usher song sounds like a real lead guitar or maybe a Yamaha Motif. Playing guitar on keyboard (like that guy did with reason) you need to use keys, pitchbend, aftertouch, legato and mod wheel to get that sound.
I appreciate this advice : )

So pitchbend, aftertouch, legato, and mod wheel

forge
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Post by forge » Fri Nov 28, 2008 1:50 am

seriously, you must know someone who knows someone who plays guitar - just get the real thing

Angstrom
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Post by Angstrom » Fri Nov 28, 2008 2:08 am

also, remember that playing 'guitar' solos on a keyboard is pretty much a social death sentence.
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Da hand
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Post by Da hand » Fri Nov 28, 2008 7:18 am

Angstrom wrote:also, remember that playing 'guitar' solos on a keyboard is pretty much a social death sentence.
Ha ha, so true.

supamonsta
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Post by supamonsta » Mon Dec 01, 2008 7:44 pm

Forge wrote:just get the real thing
absolutely true. We electronic musicians often forget the true value of a real instrument, and of a real instrument player.

electronics, softwares... won't turn us into omnipotent multi-musicians ;)

Ezmyrelda
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Post by Ezmyrelda » Wed Dec 03, 2008 2:18 am

All this is very good.. modeled instruments are getting more realistic though. I just found a demo for "open guitar" vst. Sounds very realistic and does strumming better than other vsts I've heard. Costs $40 USD though.

Da hand
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Post by Da hand » Thu Dec 04, 2008 3:41 pm

Ezmyrelda wrote:All this is very good.. modeled instruments are getting more realistic though. I just found a demo for "open guitar" vst. Sounds very realistic and does strumming better than other vsts I've heard. Costs $40 USD though.
One thing to keep in mind is that there is a difference between modeling an instrument in a production, where you can tweak every parameter to your heart's content, and trying to emulate the same instrument live.

I agree that you can get extremely convincing results of most instruments nowadays in production situations, where you can take your time to ponder each note. In live situations it is much more difficult, if not impossible. This is not due to the samples and capabilities of the software, but more down to the controller you use to emulate the instrument.

One has to remember that the original instrument is the best controller for that instrument's sound. The sound of the instrument is a result of how one can control the sound of that instrument.

For example, You can play (hammer on), bend and vibrate a note on a guitar all at the same time with one finger. You would need at least three fingers (or equivalents of) to do the same on a keyboard.

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