Help regarding frequencies

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DiogoReis
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Help regarding frequencies

Post by DiogoReis » Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:03 pm

Hi. I own Ableton Live 8 Suite and I'm having a bit of trouble with a couple of things:

1st - When using my headphones I can clearly set apart the bassline from the rest but when I hear the mix on the monitors it all sounds muffled on the lower end without definition. Do you have any tips you can give me on this matter? I'm using notes in the c1 to c2 octave for the bassline.

2nd - What could cause a kick to sound full on the speakers but flimsy on the headphones and what's a good way to make a balanced kick whether hearing it through phones or through speakers?

I'm getting a bit frustrated because when I'm producing on the phones it all sounds reasonably good but then I hear it through the speakers and it's like a different track.

Any advices that could be useful to me on this concern would be appreciated.

I'm using Live 8 with NI Komplete 5 to produce minimal/techno.

Thanks.

Trial and Error
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by Trial and Error » Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:21 pm

The headphones might be your best bet if they are a decent pair. Your studio monitors can sound weird in a room with no acoustic treatment and it depends on the built in x-over they have.

buzby
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by buzby » Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:45 pm

there is a plug in which you can find on kvr which simulates the sound of working on monitors when you are working on headphones - i cant remember the name of it though .. maybe someone else does

you can set the distance between the "monitors" and the distance from which you are situated from the "monitors" - and other little adjustments

sorry this is a bit vague and not sure if it would be what you are looking for but maybe worth a try
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DiogoReis
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by DiogoReis » Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:58 pm

buzby wrote:there is a plug in which you can find on kvr which simulates the sound of working on monitors when you are working on headphones - i cant remember the name of it though .. maybe someone else does

you can set the distance between the "monitors" and the distance from which you are situated from the "monitors" - and other little adjustments

sorry this is a bit vague and not sure if it would be what you are looking for but maybe worth a try
I've tried that VST. Not sure about it's results.

Is the problem I'm having related to the way I work (or don't) the bass and kick frequencies or is it something related to monitors/acoustics?

Tone Deft
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by Tone Deft » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:28 pm

I trust KVR but that VST sounds retarded. you'd have to know the profile of the headphones to get that result.

it's not room treatment, not unless he's playing really loud.

my bet is that your monitors need foam under them because they're resting on a not very solid surface. this can suck the bass out of any monitor, can you post a pic of them? what kind are they.

I had this same thing happen when I set up my Adam A7s, the bass was muddy and non existent. Auralex foam under them cleaned up the sound.
oddstep wrote:I agree with all of this. I'm just bored of writing "its music, just listen and trust your judgement"

Superchibisan
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by Superchibisan » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:28 pm

what speakers are you using? are you in a treated room? what headphones are you using?

have you run your track through a spectrum analyzer to check the freq balance? have you compared your kick and bass freqs on this analyzer?

lots of questions. i need answers to them all!

Aeroplay
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by Aeroplay » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:47 pm

Superchibisan wrote:what speakers are you using? are you in a treated room? what headphones are you using?

have you run your track through a spectrum analyzer to check the freq balance? have you compared your kick and bass freqs on this analyzer?

lots of questions. i need answers to them all!


:wink:

yeah your asking the right questions, man
and thats is a very important thing!


@DiogoReis:

Since I guess that your headphones might be better then your monitors, I would either trust in them. If you get the bass good on good headphones, it should probably be ok.




best regards
By really understanding art, you become an artist yourself

H20nly
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by H20nly » Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:56 pm

Postition of your monitors may be messing with you too.

If you've got em blasting straight ahead and you're working right inbetween them then you're missing the sweet spot. Someone standing 3 or 4 feet behind you may think your mix is kick ass, but you could be missing it.

Bierman
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by Bierman » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:54 pm

speakers near walls or corners tend to create all sorts of resonance in the bass end... and also yeah isolate your monitors from the surface theyre sitting on (I have some Auralex pads and they're fairly cheap and do the job admirably)

also I find it really helps to be anal about each individual element of your tunes vis a vis eq. for example, solo your hi-hats... are you hearing any low mids in there, at all? even a tiny bit? GET RID. small amounts of eq on loads of elements of your tracks (cut, don't boost... well as a general rule anyway) will eventually lead to much superior separation... and think about how your kick and bass work together frequency-wise. for example if your kick is really big in the sub range, ie 60 hz and below, you'd probably do well to shelf off a bit in that range for the bass.

michaellpenman
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by michaellpenman » Wed Jun 10, 2009 7:01 am

Yeah i would more into your room
plus what sound you are using are they clashing?
First make sur eyou have sounds that compliment each other

dru
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by dru » Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:22 am

Isolate your monitors, MoPads or make u're own MoPads.

Superchibisan
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by Superchibisan » Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:52 pm

goddamnit, original poster needs to answer my qu3stions

DiogoReis
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by DiogoReis » Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:39 pm

Hi. Thanks for all the responses. I'll upload some photos of my setup and more details in a couple of hours when I have the chance!

Superchibisan
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by Superchibisan » Wed Jun 10, 2009 9:58 pm

don't need photos, just you, to tell me, what you're using. specs are far more informative than photos

DiogoReis
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Re: Help regarding frequencies

Post by DiogoReis » Wed Jun 10, 2009 10:32 pm

I'm using M-Audio BX8 Deluxe monitors. They are placed near the wall in an attic, so I guess the acoustics are far from the recommended but I have no other option as of now. The speakers are standing on a wooden desk and they have a little foam-like paper just to prevent them from directly sitting on top of the desk.

The headphones I use are a pair of Allen & Heath XD53 which alternate in use with my DJ setup.

My kick frequencies are around 50hz and the bass frequencies peak at around 35hz (played in the f1 and e1 notes). This, according to the spectrum utility. I also have my bass compressed in sidechain with the kick.

On the phones I can set apart all elements and they might seem balanced, on the speakers some elements sound too flimsy, others sound almost nonexistent.

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