anyone using ableton as a live on stage mic mixer?

[Eric Zang]

Has anyone tried using ableton as their live on stage mixer? With a strong enough computer and ultra low latency interface (card bus or maybe firewire if good enough) perhaps it is possible?

I would like to run about 16 mic channels in (AD), and about 4 channels out (DA). Most channels would have some plugins (probably ableton native ones), many with eqs, a couple with compressors, a reverb, a delay, misc special fx. I would add a control surface for quick access to mixing.

I've been considering a digital mixer, first I considered the presonus studiolive, then a motu mk3 interface with its built in mixer and effects (eq, compressor, reverb), then the RML SAC software mixer, and now this idea. I'd try it myself of course, but I don't have the new hardware to put it to the test yet.

Thanks!

[darth_fader]

Depeche Mode ran their whole drum kit through Live on their last tour, so this should work. Look on the Ableton site there is a video somewhere.

[zalo]

i think youre best bet is going to be a mixer/soundcard like the allen and heath zed r16

aside from something like that you are going to have to buy some combination of mic pres, AD/DA, and computer interface

to keep it cheaper than the allen and heath you could do something like 2 m audio octanes and an rme multiface 2

aside from that mixer though, i dont know of a single prosumer sound card with 16 mic pres

[Eric Zang]

Thanks for the replies. Wow, that video is impressive and gives me hope! Too bad there is no mention of what interface. From what I've been finding, an RME (FF800 or Digiface for my needs) unit is the safest way to go, but cheaper options that may also work at super low latency with a fast enough computer might be the m-audio profire 26, according to the RML SAC FAQ (and I wonder maybe the similar featured presonus firestudio 26 & focusrite 26 models?). I'll be adding two units of some company's version of the 8 pres with ADAT out rack to get my mic inputs to 16 or 24.

The zed (& studiolive) looks very nice, but having as compact a rig as practical is an important aspect for my needs.

So I wonder if anyone is having success at super low latencies with something other than an RME.

BTW, I also want to record everything on their individual tracks (into ableton I suppose) at the same time. Hopefully this won't be too taxing on the system.

[Blue4Ice]

I have ben thinking of doing similar for a while but haven't had the bottle to do it at a gig My concern is if the computer either crashes or worst still wont boot when you arrive to a gig you have no mixing board and therefore can't play anything.

At present we use a Spirit digital 328 mixing desk which has a couple of compressors built in (used on vocals) and two effects units. This desk has 16 mic/line inputs but also has 16 ADAT in/outs. The next stage of the master plan is to run 8 channels of ADAT out into my EMU 1616M and use the DSP processing on the 1616M to process drums (similar to Depeche Mode vid on Abletone site). I will then return the 8 tracks to 8 of the ADAT in, turn off "Route to Mix" for the 8 channels of analogue drum inputs and just use the returns from the EMU. At least using this method if the computer crashed or EMU stops working I can quickly re-route the analogue signals to mix and the rest of the band can still perform the set whilst I fix the problem.

[zalo]

out of everyone i know, i get the lowest latencies with my RME FF400

that being said, for what you are doing you are going to need something even better than that

i really think RME is your best bet, and the digiface or multifaceII will give you the lowest latencies/lowest cpu bump

the digiface will require an external DA and the multiface can only go up to 18 in

no matter what you decide on for the soundcard, this is a big project and is going to need a top computer

best of luck

[borg]

Have a look at the sonic core Xite.

I know... it's close to 3,000 euros, but after working for 10 years with it's smaller PCI brothers, I can say it's all worth it.
Then again, you would need pre amped AD convertors on top of that. That would be a 5,000 euro set, at least, without counting a computer.

However, you get a top shelf production/mixing platform working at ZERO latency (when not interfacing to a sequencer), and all the processing power you'll ever need without taxing the CPU.

I'll get one whenever OSX software is released.


enough dreaming...

I've been working with an RME multiface for years now on a powerbook, and have done dumps from 2" 16track tape machines (using a second ADAT convertor) without any problems. I still use this 'old' setup in a theatre production to run a bunch of mics into Live (Live eq and compression).
Last week I got the M-audio 2626 for the MBP, as I found the upgrade for the RME way too expensive (over 300 euros, just to get an expresscard instead of pcmcia). I haven't fully tested the 2626, but it seems to be just fine for my needs at the moment.

[Eric Zang]

@Borg, yes the profire 2626 looks like a good firewire choice. I'm interested to know how it performs with 26 ins and 4 outs in use.

So far the most likely solution for my needs looks to be an rme digiface with expresscard, with presonus digimax FS & D8 pres going adat into it. And a really great new computer of course. (A profire would save me some $ and 1 less box to carry (the half rack digiface).

[zalo]

you can rack the digiface with the other gear

http://www.rme-audio.de/en_products_rackmounts.php

[graphicrage]

I'm doing it somewhat as my duo partner is also using Live as a mixer for her set up and sending her tracks to me via optical adat out, so we've got 16 tracks running - 8 from my set up and 8 from her.

we're both using motu 828s.

[aftertouch]

i luv running the 8outs of an mpc into 8 audio channels in live. so many possibilities.