Program change different scenes

[mikikiki666]

I've tried yesterday ableton for the first time. I come from Cubase and kontakt, but I find Ableton live really amazing, everything seems to be in the right place.

I was wondering what should be the correct scenario for my band. We are two, we activate midi samples with a keyboard and drumpads. What I want is simple:Every instrument should have its own set of scenes, but this, at a first view, doesn't seem possible in Live. I imagine I must use scenes in the session view to play live samples and use intreument such as samplers to have the sample transposed on the keyboard

But we want to be indipendent, so that I can make a "program change" skipping to another scene, without influencing what is doing the other musician

Everything in our music is free from quantize and structure

How can I do this program change between indipendent scenes?

[mikikiki666]

Maybe I can do this in another way?

[darkenedsoul]

Are you both using one instance of Live on a laptop? You'd both need to have laptops in order to do different scenes for each musician/player. If you change a scene while playing and then he wants next scene it will go to it but you would have to switch to your scene, etc...but that won't work for stuff going on at the same time, hence needing two laptops/two lives, one on each laptop to the best of my knowledge. I could be wrong but don't think so.

Mike

[Tone Deft]

explore using 'crel-e' on clips slots to remove the stop button from clips.

suppose your instruments are on tracks 1 and 2, his are on 3 and 4.

scene 1 you have clips on tracks 1 and 2, nothing on 3 and 4. select the empty clip slots in track 3 and 4 and hit ctrl-e to remove the stop button. now when you launch that scnene, your clips will fire but not turn his off.

hope that helps, kind of an awkward explanation.

[darkenedsoul]

explore using 'crel-e' on clips slots to remove the stop button from clips.

suppose your instruments are on tracks 1 and 2, his are on 3 and 4.

scene 1 you have clips on tracks 1 and 2, nothing on 3 and 4. select the empty clip slots in track 3 and 4 and hit ctrl-e to remove the stop button. now when you launch that scnene, your clips will fire but not turn his off.

hope that helps, kind of an awkward explanation.

Hey Tone,

But I think the question is can they both be switching scenes in this way? i.e. scene 1 & 2 player 1, scene 3 & 4 player 2: Player 1 starts his scene and jams along, player 2 kicks off scene 3, and while scene 3 is playing player 1 kicks scene 2 off and vice versa. This will not affect each others scenes *playing* when the other launches? Hmm, may have to test that out for grins as that is cool if it allows them to both be doing different scenes and not stopping each others when changing their own scenes.

Mike

[Tone Deft]

sure, one guy puts his stuff on even numbered scenes, the other guy on odd numbered scenes. then ctrl-a to select all scenes then ctrl-e to remove all the clip stop buttons. that way no scene launch will ever stop the other guy's stuff from playing.

[mikikiki666]

This is incredible... why the didn't have tought about such a thing?

Even if I had 2 notebook, with 2 live and 2 soundcard... there is still another problem: I will use both instrument and clips in every scene; I use te clips, because I had found amazing the way you can play a sample (trigger, toggle and so on) and I use sampler to organize the samples in zones. But if I pass to another scene, even alone, ALL the clips start playing. I can't believe there is no way to recall a scene without playing all the clips

Maybe the scene is not a concept done to recall sets, but only to play them?

If so Ableton is not my program and I unfortunately have to come back to Cubase and Kontakt which are not so intuitive and neasy, but provide much more flexiblity...

[darkenedsoul]

Why is it a problem about the clips launching? That's what the scenes are supposed to do, play what's in that row. If that's a problem then perhaps split up stuff you want into other scenes? Or am I missing something here? I think of scenes are song pieces, intro scene 1, verse scene 2, chorus scene 3, bridge scene 4, go back to scene 2, scene 3, scene 2, scene 4, etc...that's at least how I'd be using them if I did. And I do somewhat as I work out progressions for the clips. Then bounce them as I run them for recording to arrangement view and go from there. I don't do much moving around of stuff in arrangement view. I need to look into that more for other things to do there if needed.

Mike

[outershpongolia]

Why is it a problem about the clips launching? That's what the scenes are supposed to do, play what's in that row. If that's a problem then perhaps split up stuff you want into other scenes? Or am I missing something here? I think of scenes are song pieces, intro scene 1, verse scene 2, chorus scene 3, bridge scene 4, go back to scene 2, scene 3, scene 2, scene 4, etc...that's at least how I'd be using them if I did. And I do somewhat as I work out progressions for the clips. Then bounce them as I run them for recording to arrangement view and go from there. I don't do much moving around of stuff in arrangement view. I need to look into that more for other things to do there if needed.

Mike

I think something along the lines of making certain clips NOT launch when their scene is launched would help. It's been talked about before, for some people it's like 'huh? doesn't that defeat the purpose of a scene' but for others it would save them the trouble of duplicating a scene with only a small variation. I might be going OT here, my bad.

[darkenedsoul]

Hmm, well the only other thing I can think of is that he could assign a button or something to his keyboard (MIDI?) to toggle mute for certain tracks when switching through the scenes to silence the clips he doesn't want to run....BUT that means more work/good timing for this to happen in a live situation. That's all I got on this topic as I'm no DJ so it doesn't affect me. I'm just tossing out ideas is all.

Peace,
Mike

[outershpongolia]

Hmm, well the only other thing I can think of is that he could assign a button or something to his keyboard (MIDI?) to toggle mute for certain tracks when switching through the scenes to silence the clips he doesn't want to run....BUT that means more work/good timing for this to happen in a live situation. That's all I got on this topic as I'm no DJ so it doesn't affect me. I'm just tossing out ideas is all.

Peace,
Mike

Ya dude, sometimes just tossin' out random idea's sparks an idea in someones head and it's the ultimate advice, so it's appreciated.

[yur2die4]

1. You can't do the even/odd thing in the even that they might both want to start different scenes at the same time.
2. You guys could use Grouped tracks instead of Scenes. (although that would limit your up/down options?)
3. This might sound ghetto as heck but you can click the "Allow Multiple Instances" button in Preferences to use more than one instance on a laptop... The problem though still seems to be coming down to soundcard.. I swear I thought I was able to rewire Live into Live.. =/

[Tone Deft]

1. so set Live to a long quantize setting. 2 measures should easily work, I'd go with 1 and practice your timing.

2. don't see how Group Tracks would work.

3. you can have two instances of Live open but only one can have the sound engine turned on.

[yur2die4]

In the case of 1. if they were both transitioning to a new part (scene 2 for one, scene 3 for the other), which would get the priority?

Grouped tracks allows you to trigger all tracks within a horizontal row (scenes) from within the group. If each artist had their own Group, they could each trigger their own material.

[Tone Deft]

true but I might say that's the same as launching a scene, a Group Track scene is like a mini-scene.

either way, it's options for them to check out, play with and practice. lots of good ideas.


dunno, I'm kinda dazed after a 12 hour work day.