How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

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Shane Collins
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How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by Shane Collins » Sun Nov 27, 2011 12:03 pm

How would you go about doing this in ableton?

http://howtomakeelectronicmusic.com/how ... -sine-wave

BassTooth
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by BassTooth » Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:49 pm

why would you want to do it that way? just my opinion. I'd rather make a kick from scratch, one with a longer tail. making kicks is pretty easy. rather than go through all that editing.

also, I like adding the Saturator plugin to kicks.

by the way, I don't know that Ableton even has a way to insert sine wave to a sample, then edit it in. you could produce a sine wave with Operator and edit that in, but then you're already halfway there to making a kick drum, so why not just make a new kick?

aradder
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by aradder » Mon Nov 28, 2011 1:46 am

You can create a sine track playing a continuous sine tone (make sure you pitch it properly to your tune). Now throw a Gate effect on there. Turn the Gate's sidechain on and assign it to the kick track (or if you're using a full kit type drumloop track you can use the sidechain EQ to only grab the low frequencies from the sidechain input). There ya go. Play with the gate release time to get the correct tail.

Z3NO
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by Z3NO » Fri Dec 30, 2011 12:35 am

aradder wrote:You can create a sine track playing a continuous sine tone (make sure you pitch it properly to your tune). Now throw a Gate effect on there. Turn the Gate's sidechain on and assign it to the kick track (or if you're using a full kit type drumloop track you can use the sidechain EQ to only grab the low frequencies from the sidechain input). There ya go. Play with the gate release time to get the correct tail.
True.
But this technique only really makes sense if you're using recorded live drum sounds which lack the low end sine to make it full.
If you are creating a drum sound from scratch it makes no sense and you might as well do as BassTooth suggested, in which case, that article has got to be one the most brutal cases of 'beat-a-horse-to-death-with-a-stick' I've ever seen.

petezman
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by petezman » Fri Dec 30, 2011 8:30 pm

Z3NO wrote:
aradder wrote:You can create a sine track playing a continuous sine tone (make sure you pitch it properly to your tune). Now throw a Gate effect on there. Turn the Gate's sidechain on and assign it to the kick track (or if you're using a full kit type drumloop track you can use the sidechain EQ to only grab the low frequencies from the sidechain input). There ya go. Play with the gate release time to get the correct tail.
True.
But this technique only really makes sense if you're using recorded live drum sounds which lack the low end sine to make it full.
If you are creating a drum sound from scratch it makes no sense and you might as well do as BassTooth suggested, in which case, that article has got to be one the most brutal cases of 'beat-a-horse-to-death-with-a-stick' I've ever seen.
To my understanding, OP wasn't asking how to make drum sound from scratch: he was asking how use this method in Ableton.

Also, I dont get it: WHY it actually makes sense using ONLY live drum sounds with this method? Is there a "rule" somewhere? There's thousands of synthesized kick drum samples with perfect high end but a little light low end so why not just go and use this method? Why you need to re-create it from scratch? In my opinion, this is a common method in electronic music production.

I think it's all about what kind of kick drum you want. If you find a nice kick from your sample collection, but it lacks the low end, what stops you adding some lows to it with sine wave?

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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by Machinate » Mon Jan 02, 2012 12:03 am

this technique is *essential* for doing crunchy east-coast'ish hip hop beats, in my mind. Layered with a sampled breakbeat kick and you get the best of both worlds.
mbp 2.66, osx 10.6.8, 8GB ram.

RoCi
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by RoCi » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:46 am

1. create the kick with no sub but with bass of course.

2.get any sine wave (preferably a plug in synth that has one.

3.on the sub channel insert audio affects rack with 2 chains.

4.mute the second chain and add an eq so that only the sub/bass in going through.

5. now on the kick add gate and turn on the sidechain (from the sub) so that everytime the kick hits the sub comes in from there tune it up to how you like it.(release,attack, ect.)

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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by RoCi » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:50 am

and for more weight, its all about eq and compression which takes practice and time to get good at it, no one cant tell you how to. its just of matter learning it yourself because there isnt any magic knob position on the eq and compresser thatll get what you want. you have to understand that.

just practice practice practice.

but what helps is downsampling. (mpc, sp1200, ect.) there is an effects rack that simulates an sp1200 i just dont know the link or where i had found it, but that things helps on kicks to add weight and punch.

RoCi
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by RoCi » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:52 am

and this is the link to the steps i typed down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ux7qb5e98k

sanfoin
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by sanfoin » Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:06 am

As petezman said, doubling the kick drum with a deep sine wave is a common technique in electronic music. To the OP: since Live lacks audio editing capabilities you can't do what that tutorial is suggesting.

But why not just insert a synth and play a low note with an appropriate preset? Hell, it needn't even be a sine.

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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by sanfoin » Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:10 am

RoCi - that's really useful info about sidechaining with the gate. Alot of people know about doing that w/ the compressor but not the gate.

You can also do it w/ the auto filter.

Check out this tutorial. . . http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun11/a ... h-0611.htm

RoCi
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by RoCi » Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:33 am

sanfoin wrote:As petezman said, doubling the kick drum with a deep sine wave is a common technique in electronic music. To the OP: since Live lacks audio editing capabilities you can't do what that tutorial is suggesting.

But why not just insert a synth and play a low note with an appropriate preset? Hell, it needn't even be a sine.
you can do ALOT in live just gotta know it like the back of your hand. the steps i told him is the best thing to do for what he wants in live.

RoCi
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by RoCi » Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:36 am

sanfoin wrote:RoCi - that's really useful info about sidechaining with the gate. Alot of people know about doing that w/ the compressor but not the gate.

You can also do it w/ the auto filter.

Check out this tutorial. . . http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun11/a ... h-0611.htm
yes you can sidechain with the autofilter. but you cant trigger a sine wave with it as good as the effects rack technique.

sanfoin
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by sanfoin » Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:39 am

RoCi wrote: you can do ALOT in live just gotta know it like the back of your hand. the steps i told him is the best thing to do for what he wants in live.
no matter how well you know it you still can't edit audio in live :roll:

the best thing is to just use a synth or whatever and forgo the gate.

(btw I wasn't linking that article to you directly or intending to get off topic - just brought it up in the context of sidechaining because it was fresh)

RoCi
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Re: How can you add more weight to your kick drums with sine

Post by RoCi » Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:49 pm

sanfoin wrote:
RoCi wrote: you can do ALOT in live just gotta know it like the back of your hand. the steps i told him is the best thing to do for what he wants in live.
no matter how well you know it you still can't edit audio in live :roll:

the best thing is to just use a synth or whatever and forgo the gate.

(btw I wasn't linking that article to you directly or intending to get off topic - just brought it up in the context of sidechaining because it was fresh)

dude you can edit in arrangement view, in sampler especially, you can warp audio, in your clip sample box you can reverse audio and pull up the envelope and fuck with all that. plus a lot more, i dont feel like typing.

like i said you just have to know live.

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