911 was an inside job ?

Discussion of anything not related to audio or music production

Was 911 an inside job ?

Of course
19
32%
Possibly
13
22%
Probably
10
17%
I don't think so
7
12%
No
11
18%
 
Total votes: 60

djsynchro
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by djsynchro » Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:08 pm

djsynchro wrote:when your dad fucked your mum to make you it was an inside job too
it just worked

djsynchro
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by djsynchro » Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:08 pm

djsynchro wrote:
djsynchro wrote:when your dad fucked your mum to make you it was an inside job too
it just worked
this

funky shit
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by funky shit » Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:08 am

:lol:
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leedsquietman
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by leedsquietman » Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:39 am

so it would be appropriate at gearslutz or kvr or _______ forums? i don't think it's appropriate at any forum.
The LOUNGE is set up to discuss non music stuff. I'm not a huge fan of all this political stuff too, but Ableton don't have a problem with it (seemingly) and plenty of other political and non music debates such as debating religion, Middle East issues or stereotyping people's countries is apparently no problem. You might not like it, you have an option to not comment and walk on by, or you can jump in an pour some fuel on the flames but if you do so, you can't complain if people come back at you with views you don't like.

Where governments are concerned nothing is transparent and while most conspiracy theories are crackpot stuff, SOME information re 911 comes from very creditable sources, especially stuff like the government knew about the possibility of an attack but did less than they could to investigate quickly, which MAY have prevented some of the incidents which occurred. I have 2 cousins in the British Army, both of whom have done tours in Northern Ireland, and one in Iraq and one in Afghanistan, so I am not disrespecting the fallen etc.
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McQ714
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by McQ714 » Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:59 am

maybe we should ask Ableton what their opinion is on this topic and then get all pissed off when they don't take sides and then we can bash people we haven't met and then we can tell ableton to ban us from the forum!?!?

Machinesworking
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by Machinesworking » Mon Sep 06, 2010 1:00 am

McQ714 wrote:do any of you idiots realize how much oil we already have in the US? it's just that getting it from the middle east is cheaperdue to labor rates. so oil companies focus their efforts over there rather than here.
OK you're calling people idiots and flatly stating that our interest in middle eastern oil is due to middle eastern labor being cheaper????
Jesus fuck I hope you're 15 years old, or have some other valid excuse for your complete lack of a clue???

McQ714
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by McQ714 » Mon Sep 06, 2010 1:09 am

Machinesworking wrote:
McQ714 wrote:do any of you idiots realize how much oil we already have in the US? it's just that getting it from the middle east is cheaperdue to labor rates. so oil companies focus their efforts over there rather than here.
OK you're calling people idiots and flatly stating that our interest in middle eastern oil is due to middle eastern labor being cheaper????
Jesus fuck I hope you're 15 years old, or have some other valid excuse for your complete lack of a clue???

so you disagree that the US has billions of barrels of oil here?? and you disagree that non-US labor is cheaper? do you have any clue why American companies outsource? do you have any clue why so many of the consumer products we use aren't made here? or did you think they were? seems the grunge scene of the 90s really fucked you up in the head. why are we interested in oil from the middle east when we have plenty here, then??? fill me in, MW. you seem to know it all, oh wise one!

on second thought.. fuck it, i don't care what you think you know!

smutek
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by smutek » Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:09 am

wow... :lol:

ChiDJ
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by ChiDJ » Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:55 am

I stay away from this shit for a reason.


It enrages me.

I prefer to be aware of the matrix. I want the machines to think I'm plugged in.

Craig's list stopped posting ADULT ads yesterday. :cry:
"Let you're body feel the sound! Let it cover you up and down!"

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martinkellogs
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by martinkellogs » Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:25 am

edited
Last edited by martinkellogs on Wed Jan 19, 2011 6:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

martinkellogs
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by martinkellogs » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:42 am

edited
Last edited by martinkellogs on Wed Jan 19, 2011 6:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

Emissary
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by Emissary » Mon Sep 06, 2010 8:18 am

McQ714 wrote:
Machinesworking wrote:
McQ714 wrote:do any of you idiots realize how much oil we already have in the US? it's just that getting it from the middle east is cheaperdue to labor rates. so oil companies focus their efforts over there rather than here.
OK you're calling people idiots and flatly stating that our interest in middle eastern oil is due to middle eastern labor being cheaper????
Jesus fuck I hope you're 15 years old, or have some other valid excuse for your complete lack of a clue???

so you disagree that the US has billions of barrels of oil here?? and you disagree that non-US labor is cheaper? do you have any clue why American companies outsource? do you have any clue why so many of the consumer products we use aren't made here? or did you think they were? seems the grunge scene of the 90s really fucked you up in the head. why are we interested in oil from the middle east when we have plenty here, then??? fill me in, MW. you seem to know it all, oh wise one!

on second thought.. fuck it, i don't care what you think you know!

America hit peak oil in the 70s. After peak oil in any country the oil becomes exponentially more expensive to pump from the ground . So america began importing oil from the gulf, Venezuela etc. Saudi Arabia hit peak oil somewhere in the ealry 00s, the only place left in the gulf that hadn't hit peak at that time was Iraq. Infact Bush managed to preserve the american way of life for another decade due to his invasion of iraq. Now the World has hit Peak oil and there are no planets in the solar system we can import crude from. Hence the world will now enter a huge depression caused by lack of cheap energy. Look up Jevons law and hubberts Peak.

And by the way Peak oil is not the running out of oil, it is the halfway point in oil reserves. So yes there are still billions of barrels still left in the ground, its just they are not profitable to remove from the ground. If oil companies can't make a profit why bother to pump? If you follow worldwide Peak oil through to its conclusion it takes you to a scary place.

McQ714
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by McQ714 » Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:45 pm

I will admit I don't know much of the oil industry, although, one google search of term "peak oil" and I was able to read a few pages of the debunking of Hirsch's theory. I also came across a USGS survey of oil fields up in the Montana area that estimates of the amount of recoverable oil were recently increased 25-fold to about 3.5 billion barrels. Estimates of using this oil were as low as $16 per barrel. It sure would be nice to pay about a $1 per gallon for gas. Doubt that will happen though!

smutek
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by smutek » Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:21 pm

McQ714 wrote: I also came across a USGS survey of oil fields up in the Montana area that estimates of the amount of recoverable oil were recently increased 25-fold to about 3.5 billion barrels. Estimates of using this oil were as low as $16 per barrel. It sure would be nice to pay about a $1 per gallon for gas. Doubt that will happen though!
Considering we (The United States) alone use 18.69 million barrels every day, 3.5 billion barrels would last us, what - about 6 months before it's gone?

Then what?

Also, note that 18.69 million bbl/day is a probably a fairly conservative estimate, as I pulled it from the World Fact Book, I've also read much higher estimates on oil consumption in the states.

Emissary
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Re: 911 was an inside job ?

Post by Emissary » Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:21 pm

McQ714 wrote:I will admit I don't know much of the oil industry, although, one google search of term "peak oil" and I was able to read a few pages of the debunking of Hirsch's theory. I also came across a USGS survey of oil fields up in the Montana area that estimates of the amount of recoverable oil were recently increased 25-fold to about 3.5 billion barrels. Estimates of using this oil were as low as $16 per barrel. It sure would be nice to pay about a $1 per gallon for gas. Doubt that will happen though!
If I type in "Michael jackson is still alive" this also comes up with many hits that claim that the statement is true. googling something for 10 minutes is not quite the same as researching something for 5 years and reading every single side of the problem objectively, People who debunk Peak oil fall into 2 groups.

a) The group that believes oil is abiotic and as such is made by the earth and is unlimited. This has no scientific proof whatsoever.

b) The group that think peak oil is going to disrupt distribution but that we can easily overcome it by using hydrogen/bio fuel/electricity transportation.

The first group is obviously not worth bother debating. The 2nd group don't actually understand the problem. The Problem is that hydrocarbons are used for virtually everything on the planet today. For instance lets just take the instance of farming and the problems a fuel shortage would have on them.

Virtually all arable land is america is DEAD, this is the first point you have to understand. The only reason crops can grow is because of fertiliser which is made from Natural gas and transported via oil. Pesticides are also created using oil..

So the farmer comes along in his oil powered vehicle and fertilises the ground, then he comes back in another vehicle and sows the crops, he then comes along in another vehicle and sprays pesticide. He then comes along again in another oil powered vehicle and harvests. At which point he loads the produce onto an oil powered truck which takes it to a packing centre, here people who got to work using their oil powered cars then wrap the produce in plastic (oil) and put it on another oil powered truck to take to the supermarket. People then get in their oil powered cars and drive to the supermarkets and pay for the produce on their credit cards made from plastic (oil)

This doesn't even cover the preparing and cooking of food.

Biofuel is a non starter as you would need all the arable land in america just to power the amount of traffic in america, leaving nothing to eat. Nuclear and renewables could supply energy to power transportation, but the increase on the Grid of having all those electric cars (which nobody can afford anyway) plugged in at night would cause huge brownouts and blackouts. Also people forget the huge amount of oil needed to actually build the car including the paints and resins and tyres

Human population has increased exponentially and in no time in any scientific study of any organism on the earth has there ever been a case where a species which comes across a favorable set of living circumstances (like we had last century) and overpopulates does not then immediately crash when those favorable circumstances are taken away or lost. Cheap energy (for now) is a thing of the past, so we can scientifically only expect a huge population die off.

If someone finds a cheap viable technological way to power all the vehicles on the planet, create medicines, paints, rubber and keep crops from being destroyed then we may be able to just about sustain the current population. There are no signs of this happening however. The reason we used oil is because it was stupidly easy to recover and had immense power. There is no way we can replace that ease of use and power for a very long time.

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